oldsguybry

Hey guys , I figured I would take this time to tell my story of misfortune with American cars after 2000.... My wife bought two cars in 2001 , a brand new Chevy Cavalier Z24 and a few years later , a used Chrysler town & country mini van. The van had 40,000 miles on it and had to replace transmission at 47,000 , took van to transmission place....$2300.00 later we got the van back , in two weeks the tranny failed again already , so we took it back. The van then was fine for 20,000 miles and the tranny went again , this time I went to the garage I usually went to (which has a better warranty ) and got a new tranny for another $2300.00 to which we had to bring back in a year cause van would not go into gear. Finally they sent the whole tranny to the rebuild place and they calibrated it there , and now the van runs right and changes gears the way it should. There is no way im keeping it at this point , so gotta sell it ......now the Z24 , I found out those 2.4 DOHC Chevy motors dont last , the motor only has 70,000 miles on it and it goes throught oil about 1QT every three weeks. The oil doesnt burn , it just runs into exhaust system and destroys the cadilladic converter, hence forcing you to get the motor rebuilt , so you dont have to replace converter every year so it can pass emissions....I now am looking into an import for daily driver as soon as I can sell this garbage to someone else

72 cutlass455

Luck has a lot to do with cars. Some drive forever. Be wary of lexus and infinity both are very expensive to repair. Good luck on what ever you purchase.

Higgins

1989 Mustang GT convert, 110,000 miles. Bought new. Sold it last year. Had to put brakes and filters on it. 1992 GMC 1/2 ton v6, 150,000 miles. Bought new, sold it in 2008. Yup, had to put brakes on it a couple of times and some filters. 2002 Monte Carlo, 164,000 miles. Bought new, dang, had to put brakes and filters on it too. 2008 GMC 1/2 ton 4.8 v8, 20,000 miles. Bought new. Nope, doesn't need brakes yet, just filters.
Seriously, all I ever had to do to any of these was normal wear stuff, tires, brakes & filters. Never had any drive train problems. I have had many others, including 3 Oldsmobiles, with no problems. You could get a lemon Toyota too.

oldsguybry

There is a big difference between a $15.000 car and a $40.000 car (trucks seem to have better luck for some reason also ) if I bought a top of the line or at least better then the average car , I proly wouldnt have any problems either. I do agree that not every American car is bad , we did alot of research once we started having problems and I found the only excessive complaining going on was on the Chrysler. Oh and Higgins , im glad you have had good luck with yours ,and I never had any problems ( untill now ) with any American car since I started driving in 82....as for me , I will never buy another one newer than 2000....It seems that Mazda or Hyundai is ok....any ideas or opinions on a good car made in the last ten years would be appreciated.

455man

Fixing a foreign car is very expensive. I've only owned one. I usually run my cars into the ground. They seem to last me 150k before i start having expensive problems with them. At 109k on my current car. I know chrysler had some tranny issues a while back. Of course all cars have their one little flaw. Talk to a mechanic before buying your next car. When buying a car I look at the drivetrain then the color. Drivetrain is what gets you down the road. By the way I dont like any DOHC cars. Foreign or American. Lots of foreign cars have them.

oldsguybry

well, my wife bought both cars , I test drove them and everything was fine at that point , I wish i had a crystal ball... BTW , the van has 75,000 miles on it , and the Z24 has 68,000 on it , WAY to soon to be having any problems like that. We dont drive our vehicles like idiots....ive been working on cars and had muscle cars half my life , so i would not buy a car by the color LOL. ( maybe not the case with my wife ).......allthough I always wanted an American SUV , like a GMC Suburban or a pick-up truck. That would be the only car I would buy at this point .....ANY American truck or SUV I would buy , except for Mopar

68Tom

Also, I'm fairly sure that the quality of US cars in 2010 compared to 2000 or 2001 is (perhaps much) greater. At least this is what we're being told. lol.

I've driven both early 2000 and 2010 Chevy cars and the 2010s do seem to be of much greater quality, more solid, etc.

joe_padavano

Since you bought the van used, I don't think you can really know how much the trans was abused before you got it. That's not the fault of the vehicle, nor is the incompetency of the repair shops you took it to. My DD is the POS 84 Custom Cruiser that I bought for $250 as a parts car (Custom Cruiser front fenders are difficult to find). I've put about 30K miles on it in the last year and a half or so, and I've put about $1000 into it in total. That includes brakes, tires, exhaust, timing set, and tuneup.

bil

Various Chevy and Ford vans-lasted about 1 year each.Never paid more than 600 bucks for each,and pounded then into the ground.I will not own anything newer than 1972 except for work. Even then,I keep a 68 F250 out in Calif for when I work there. I can't stand opening the hood and not being able to see the engine. ---bil

oldsguybry

well, Joe apparently you did not read my whole thread at the top, yea the tranny could have been beat on prior to my wife buying it , but THREE TRANSMISSIONS after that? ( not the same tranny getting rebuilt over and over , Im gonna go run out and buy another Chrysler van LOL. The problems dont end there either , had issues with engine light coming on because of a variety of different reasons , the automated sliding doors dont work any more , the window wont go up or down ....etc. it goes on and on , but if you still think the vehicle is good , im selling it this spring , so if interested give me a shout.LOL

442much

In 1992 my rad gave out and pumped coolant into the tansmission of the 442. I went to AAMCO to get a tranny rebuilt I got the gauranteed for life deal. Paid $1100 instead of the standard $900 for that. It's been redone twice and cost me $0.

The original battery for the 442 died in 1981. I replaced it with a Canadian Tire battery...yep, gauranteed for life. I've been getting new batteries since 1981 nation wide since then. $0

Last year went in for shocks. The guy say it would cost me $900. I gave him the warrantee and he said $500 because labour is not covered. I told him to read the paper again. He called Midas and they told him tah I was "grandfathered in". Cost $0. New springs coming up in the Spring - same deal.

Last year, I even got my paint job gauranteed (with body work) for as long as I own the car. That's the only way I go now. Done once and "forgetaboudtit"

Dan K

Not sure I would doom all domestic car mfrs (or models for that matter) based on bad experiences with a make or model

That being said, I hear you on the mopar caravans - they are notorious for their bad transmission design. About 8 years ago, we inherited my brother's which was at about 120K, and on 2nd engine & 3rd transmission ... My wife made us get rid of it after the sliding door fell off (the second time) (despite my awesome DIY welding job)

For whatever it's worth, I've personally had good luck with Chevy trucks & SUV's as DD's... my '97 3500 7.4L crew cab 4x4 went from 90K to 160K under my ownership with only one electrical glitch with the brake lights; my current 2002 2500 4x4 6.0L crew cab, owned since 70K now about 100K, has had zero problems short of the annoying cold-start knock

My wife's 2002 suburban 1500 4x4 5.3L went from 100K to 150K with zero issues; our current 2004 2500 4x4 8.1L suburban has given us from 50K to 60K thus far with no issues.... well, except they both needed the passenger power window motor replaced at one point...

Of course, my mom and brother both have late 90's / early 2000 honda civics bought new with 200k+ miles, and nothing but scheduled maintenance.. but isn't that kind of boring?

oldsguybry

well, I apologize if I seemed a little angry on this thread , all these car problems and other financial woes is putting me one step closer in not having a place to live for me and my family. I hope Santa brings me a bag of money , I dont need a gift receipt for that , ill keep it

oldsguybry

Yea Dan , I would love a 4 x 4 SUV like the ones you mentioned , thats what we wanted in the first place but could not afford at the time.....beleive me I absolutely can NOT stand imports, but if that is my only choice down the road I may have to get one . I remember when I had money years ago , me and the wife went to Los Vegas in 99 , and had to rent a Hyundai to get around , you literally had to floor the thing to get it up to 40 MPH , and the radiator cap was the size of a 50 cent piece LOL. (my wife thought it was cute ) not what i want in a car. I hope todays Hyundai's have more power.

joe_padavano

Ni, I did read your post. I'm assuming these were not factory-new transmissions but rebuilds installed by a non-factory repair shop? You can't blame Chrylser if they didn't build the trans. That's why I wrote this above:

This is also why I do my own repairs - I've learned not to trust most repair shops.

joe_padavano

That's all?

My 1999 crewcab dually with 454 (what's this "liters" thing???) is the only vehicle I've ever bought brand new and is now nearing a quarter million miles. The engine is original but I had to put a trans in it earlier this year - mainly my fault for towing in O.D. I rebuilt the steering and front suspension at 180K and other than a steady diet of front brakes and front tires, it's really been a good vehicle. Oh, I only get 60,000 miles on a fuel pump, so I'll be looking at doing that again in a year or so.

crzyjef

I run a 1994 Cavalier (with the 2.2 4 cyl engine ) as a Daily driver..
I am the 2nd owner.. bought it in Mar 1995 with 22k on the clock
Since then other than brakes /tire etc I have had 2 water pumps 1 radiator 4 head gaskets .. the timing chain went at 169K.. and it is still going strong..
I have the opportunity to trade it out for a 1996 Prizm (same as corolla) I am opting to keep the Cav even though I know that at 180K it will blow head gasket #5 ( known problem with the car) it has been a great car for me and is in OK shape. (it does show signs of being beaten in snow weather as I deliver pizza's in it) and my next car I am thinking seriously of a Saturn. I know I want a 4 door Manual trans. beyond that the rest is still up in the air..
I also drive a 1996 burban to pull the travel trailer.. ( it is primairly a tow vehicle at this point) it has 150K on it.. (bought it with 132K 3 years ago)
My wife has an 06 Caravan with 50K on it and runs great ..
and of course the Olds.. but it is not registered at this point..
and right now only me and the wife drive...

jaunty75

There's your problem right there. It's 2010. It's almost 2011. After two U.S. manufacturers in bankruptcy, the new car world is a radically different place. As 68Tom points out, you can't compare cars made a decade ago with those made today. Try a 2010 or 2011 Ford or Chevy today before condemning them. To do so is only shortchanging yourself.

I have an '02 Dodge Dakota truck. That's about the same vintage as your minivan. I bought it used in '07 with 75,000 miles on it. It's now got 95,000 and runs like a top. Anyone can have a bad experience, and it's unfortunate that you did. It doesn't mean they're all bad.

Lady72nRob71

My 97 Caddy has only had an AC compressor and fuel pressure regulator replaced, both at the end of the extended warranty, work done at GM. I bought the car used with 30K, now is 85K. I have changed the coolant and hoses for PM, but thats about it.
I do believe that the Caddys were built better, and they better have been given their cost!
Now days, I think any computer controlled car will be a money pit waiting to happen over 120K. It may run, but electrical stuff and emission control parts will be nearing the end of their lifespan. This stuff is expensive, too, esp on foreign cars. The ladyfriend had issues with nissans and mitsus, to the point I told her to dump them.
I steered her cleay from the toyo throttle snafus and now she has a kia suv with 86k. Lets see how long this one lasts. It blows light bulbs about once a month though...
The cheapest car to own and run that I have seen is my old Pinto - simplicity does have its merits. Parts are dirt cheap, too. It has been quite reliable, too - main reason i am keeping it.
Roackauto has a vehicle maintanence and repair cost indexing calculator - it lets you see which is more expensive to repair and keep running.

oldsguybry

I'll try a new car if someone will borrow me the money, lol thats why we bought the van cause we were running out of money. As far as the early 90's Cavaliers , they were awesome , I bought a new 92 Cav and sold it in 2004 with 200,000 miles on it , I could go from one oil change to another without adding oil , and as far as the tranny place goes? You mean I had to get raped at the Chrysler dealership to get the tranny done right? BS....I went to a tranny place that SPECIALIZES in transmissions and the manager there said they had their share of those vans and he knows the tricks of the trade with them....All I know is after all the cars I had , I never had such a piece of junk in all my life... yea Chrysler , pffft , when they were around they couldnt wait to charge me 10 diagnostic charges even though I was just there the day before and they did not fix the car right. So much for the " take the van to the right place theory " Oh , good luck getting that transmission installed and calibrated right by yourself , you will have to take it in to get that done anyhow.

Rickman48

Paid $500 for a '89 S-10 Blazer 4x4 2-dr from a friend who happened to get it at an auction, w/150K, but someone installed a new factory motor, as it was black!
Drove it another 75K, just tires, brakes and a tune-up-17 MPG w/3:73's!!
Traded it for a '03 that was crashed in l/f, 102K,EVEN!! [almost ready]
18 mo. ago, found a '92 S-10 Blazer 4x4 2-dr with 64K! $1500 with a mint interior!
Brakes, tires, and cat-back exhaust, 20MPG w/3:23's - now @ 102K! Both 4.3's.
Stay away from '97 to '00's though - fuel injection comes apart under the plenum, filling the cylinders w/ fuel, which doesn't compress!

Dan K

Well, I bet my old chev is still on the road - but I sold it due to my severe problem with automotive A.D.D....

I love the modern big block chevys... and am really enjoying towing with our new (to us) 496 CUBIC INCH suburban (hey man, it says 8100 on the engine cover... wish it said 496 in big block letters on the fender!)

Red Delta

I risked buying an 07 Town and Country earlier this year. It's loaded with a bunch of electronic goodies that I'm sure will systematically break over time. But DVD and power doors with the three kiddies is something we really like.

Still, it was the last year of that body design and I figured that they would have gotten most of the garbage components worked out. The late model years of that van gets satisfactory reliability ratings and used Honda and Toyota vans are stupidly priced.

My 95 Concorde is going strong at 200,000 miles. But it has the 3.3 with a timing chain. I swore I'd never own a car again with a belt turning the camshaft. The 98 Contour (awful car and long gone) ate belts every year until we found a decent mechanic who found the problem.

nonhog

I hear ya! But its kind of funny. I work for Toyota and drive a Silverado
as my DD.
Its good but already had more issues than my old KIA (it sucked) and my
Scion XB (now my wifes) put together. But I really like driving it.
All little stuff. Knock on wood.

Aceshigh

That's Chrysler/Dodge for ya.
Transmissions were the worst from that company of any.

I hear ya about American cars.
I think Daimler Benz helped improve Chrysler alot with shared platforms.
But now that Chrylser got dumped by them at a huge loss, that shared
platform is gone. I'll never own a Dodge or Chrysler product again myself.

Same deal here.
1990 Dodge Dynasty bought at auction with 70K on it from a local Fire Chief.
Every record of maintenance done on file.....big f'n file too.

Trans failed at 77,000.

I agree with you.
That's why I bought myself a used Lexus as a daily driver while I am paying
off the remaining balance of my student loans. I know their reputation has
been stellar for 14 years with JD Powers VDS reports #1 all those years.

They had a major fail with the sticking throttle issue recently.
But mine is free and clear of those issues. Build quality differences are very evident.

Honda also had some major issues with their automatics in the Accords in the late 90's.
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Honda/Accord/1998/
But realistically that's all I've EVER seen plague them.
The most reliable economy cars are the Accord, Civic, Camry, and Corolla.

The new bailed out Corporate GM is LOOKING better and GM IMO makes the best transmissions.
I've heard that from several trans guys. But.......I dunno ,
Might be sticking to Toyota, Lexus, Honda, Acura, Nissan, Infiniti.

GoodOldsGuyDougie

My 2 cents!:::If you had bought either of those cars Brand new they both had 100,000 mile warranties on the drive train. you would have been covered on both and not pay' d a dime for a repair. Sorry USA Still makes the Best Cars. Oh and by the way try and see what a simple part cost on a Jap Car after your warranty is long over. Its usually 5 times Higher,..no Thanks for me. .... One More I have an original 1985 Monte Carlo SS, I have driven this Car almost 235,000 Miles. The motor and trans have never been touched. It's all in how a Car is taken care of.

Check out the over 20 defects on the new 2010 Toyota's. Safe as Poison!

garys 68

My $0.02.............
All car Co's wont change a defect if it doesn'y affect theier warantee. Very long history with American made cars. Before you buy, check out a forum on the car you're buying. Chances are EVERYONE on that forum will have similar problems/concerns about an issue.
American car makers have elevated that to an SOP, japanese are just catching on.

marinus_

I bought a Dodge Dakota truck in 1996 which I sold to my father in 1999. It now has almost 300k on it and never had a problem besides the regular maintenance items. It doesn't burn a drop of oil either.....

Destructor

I have two Mercury Grand Marquis, a 2000 and a 2007. They are very dependable, relatively cheap to fix and comfy. They are well known along with the Crown Vic to be very dependable cars. When I had to replace my 88 Caprice, also very dependable, I went with Ford because they were the only Full size, rear drive, BOF, V8 powered cars left worth buying. Gm killed the Caprice and it's siblings.

Higgins

Oldsguybry, I guess the majority here still prefer American brands. Of course I say buy what you want, but I think you should give GM or Ford a chance when buying new if they have what suits your needs. The quality is there and has been for quite some time. I bought Japanese in the late 1970s & early 80s because of the poor quality of U.S. brands. If I had my "druthers" I would only have rear wheel drive Oldsmobiles, but due to business the wife & I both have to have newer vehicles. The 02 Monte Carlo has been such a great car we have kept it much longer than usual.
As 455man said, if you are buying used, find out what problems have been reported on that vehicle. I know that Chrysler transmissions have been a problem. Chevy 3.1 & 3.4 v6 have intake manifold problems after 100,000 miles. Porsche 944's have timing belt problems at 60,000 miles. Don't buy a car without the knowledge you need. Good luck to you.
Higgins

oldsca

Have an 2001 F150 v6 with 230,000 km (140,000mi) and no major issues. My wife has a `07 G6 and other then the steering replacements (x2) it seems to be a good car. Fun sedan with lots of power.
Bottom line - every brand has lemons. Luck of the draw.

wayne

kevdog442

The thing I notice about American car buyers is that they are very accepting about the shortcomings of them. They say " oh all Ford transmissions go out at 100,000 miles", and "all Chevys do that". I'm sure Chryslers have a huge list. Dont get me wrong I buy them too, because I like the way they look or feel, but I usually end up almost giving them away. American cars depreciate down to nothing while Hondas hold value. I commute 130 miles a day and I dont think there is an American car that would last very long at that rate. My dd is a 200,000 mile 1990 Honda Accord that runs great and everything works. No "except for..." this and that. My wife had a 250,000 mile Honda that you couldn't even hear running at a stop light it was so smooth. Never had "only 5 head gaskets" type of thing. Just oil changes. no windows that dont work right or brake light problems or transmission rebuilds or fuel guage problems or door handles breaking off etc.
Just to be clear I'm only talking about 80's and up cars. My 68 Olds is a whole different thing. Plus I can fix it.

coltsneckbob

I live in NJ and frequently take business trips leaving fron Newark airport. I usually hire a limo service. These guys drive Town Cars, Caddies and sometimes a Chrysler. They tell me that these cars will go 250-300K so long as u change oil, trans fluid, filters and don't beat on em.

Aceshigh

Think about that for a second ^ ^ Limousines are very expensive.

Keeping them going is cheaper then buying new ones.
It's not a testament to how reliable they are. Anyone can funnel money into
any car to keep it going. Ask any fleet coordinator.

It's far cheaper to buy a NEW engine + trans then it is to buy a new limo.

This really cracked me up.

So USA makes the best cars because the NEW car warranty replaces their failed components ?? LMAO So after that 5 year warranty expires and you still have only 25,000 miles on it, it's not THEIR fault it's falling apart. BTW that 5 year warranty only started 4 years ago. So I guess prior to 2006 USA made the best cars that were new for only the first 3 years of ownership too.

Comical.

New car depreciation is horrendous. Warranty repair work is done by dealerships, not the manufacturer. If the manufacturer can't make a product that survives normal wear and tear into the 100K mark, then it's junk IMO regardless of what brand name is on it.

coltsneckbob

Amd ur point is?

made in the usa

you have a crappy trans guy for dodge my old caravan has 425,000 miles on her. Its on the second trans rebuild i sold it to a friend that drives it every day havent done anything to it in three years. My 96 caravan has 143,000 i had the trans gone threw at 103 been all over in it still drives strong. and i have never had any luck with anything that weres a bowtie

oldsguybry

GoodOldsGuyDougie , The 2001 Z24 had 3 yr 36,000 warranty , no problems yet after 60,000 miles ,BUT like I said it goes through 1QT of oil every 3 weeks approx. No leaks of any kind and no blue smoke out of tailpipe...Where is the oil going??? also I take care of my vehicles , Meaning all the required maintainance that is needed I take care of...??? These are the cars ive owned in my life....67 Olds Cutlass , 72 Buick Century, 76 Chevy Malibu, 78 Buick Regal, 68 Roadrunner , 68 Olds Toro , 72 Cutlass Supreme , 92 Chevy Cavalier...I cant remember having very many problems with any of those cars....Its obvious I love American cars , but I definately wont buy another one from 2001.

67442nut

TOYOTA.
That's all I have to say about that.

Aceshigh

One thing I will point out.
You can pick ANY model vehicle from ANY manufacturer and have several people comment
A) That it was the most reliable vehicle they owned.
B) Biggest POS they ever owned that bled their wallet.

No vehicle is 100% failure out there. So this isn't a reliable method of buying a vehicle.

So the best thing to do is look at the BIG PICTURE of Vehicle Dependability Surveys.
JD Powers does this survey based on ACTUAL warranty repairs / recalls on vehicles 3 years old.
It comes out EVERY year. Lexus was #1 for 14 years since it's inception until that sticking throttle dilemma.
Honda is always up high, and so is Toyota. I can surmise that Buick & Lincoln are based on the
average age of their buyers (over 55 years old) not going anywhere.

There is always ONE ABSOLUTE Fact with these findings.
Japanese vehicles repeatedly dominate the dependability by a large margin.
However, American cars are improving.
http://businesscenter.jdpower.com/ne...spx?ID=2010034


It's even broken down by vehicle classes and the top 3 contenders.
This is what I like to use when shopping for a used vehicle.


....over your head ???

oldsguybry

LoL , MadeInTheUSA , I suppose I had a bad mechanic on all the repairs , everyone including Chrysler were standing there scratching their heads trying to figure it out...I was at the dealership , the transmission specialist and my personal mechanic...They all said " I'd get rid of it " But your probably right , I should be waking up from this bad dream anytime now as soon as I tap my heels together three times and say " Theres no place like home " Im not imagining this, I take care of my cars , I dont beat on them (except for the Cutlass cause it can take it) Your mechanic would of been standing there too.