mmurphy77

What's the price on this stuff nowadays? My factory system is cool but not cold. I want to evap and recharge it but my local guy tells me the r12 is $90.00 a lb now and the system takes 3.75 lbs. I thought the price on this came back down. I have read endless stuff on r134a conversions and 'duracool' and 'freeze12' ad nauseam. I not interested. I would like to evap and recharge my system without it costing $500.00. Am I dreaming or is there hope?

Blk71SX

the going rate around here is $29 for a 12oz can

Lady72nRob71

It all depends where you get it.
You cannot buy it from a company anymore, so individuals would be the best source.
Put a post on your company bulletin board or ask some older guys who used to work on their old cars and now have newer ones. You never know what could be in their garage!
I bought about 6 cans from people who have had it on their shelves for years and no longer had a use for them, and I paid like 15 a can.
I am reserving these for my '86 which has to be recharged every 5 years or so.

I have not heard good things about the 'universal R12 alternatives', so I would not be interested in them either.
If you plan to restore the whole A/C system (like if it is not working at all or it leaks) 134 would be the way to go. If done right, it will work very well (though not quite as good as the "good stuff"!

Olds64

It's too bad that you aren't interested in converting to R134a. The aftermarket AC systems that run on R134a are top quality. Plus, most of them are orifice tube systems. IMHO, these run better and are easier to maintain than a suction throttling valve system.

mmurphy77

Thanks guys. I guess I'll have to look around and see if I can score some. I converted the Chevelle I had to r134a and wasn't really happy with it. As you know the 134 doesn't cool as efficiently but part of the conversion including a high pressure switch in lieu of the POA valve which detracted from the originality and made the compressor cycle/demand which I don't think they old style compressors like very much. (a lot of complaint of failure over time).

Olds64

Another good thing about the aftermarket systems is that they use a modern compressor. The modern compressors don't weigh 80lbs like the old R12 compressors do. Of course, you mentioned the originality aspect.

FWIW, I do agree with the others. If you MUST use R12 then the best way to get it is from old shade tree mechanics that might have it lying around.

mmurphy77

Yeah, originality is my primary concern. I have located a guy locally that has freon for $20 a 12.5 oz can. I assuming things have not changed as far as charging it? It's been a while - connect the service hose and open the valve with the compressor running? Should take 3-4 cans I would think.

Lady72nRob71

Yep, you seem to know the routine. Just make sure you are injecting it to the low pressure (suction) side. Use the high side on mistake and bad things can happen!

Twenty for a can isn't bad - just try to find a few more.

fly1

Yur best bet is to convert to 134a. Make sure u use a newer style serpentine condensor. U can tell by the flat tube. 134a has a different molecular structure and the serpentine coil rejects the heat a whole lot better than the basic condensor. Replace accumalator and orifice tube flush lines and use the poly ester oil. And you will be ok. There is no simply drop in replacement for r12. But I correct conversion will work just fine

Blk71SX

when I sold my business I kept 4 cases of R12. you'd be surprised how many "friends" you have when word gets around. after 12 years the well went dry but now a former competitor helps me out when the need arises.

it's not what ya know, it's who ya know

the old R12 systems are not as effecient with 134 but are better than nothing

Lady72nRob71

It's more about "what you know about who you know"!

In a couple years, i will restore my A/C and convert to 134. It will be far from a cheap job...

Blk71SX

but then again, do you ever really know them?

Olds64

If you get enough R12 then make sure you do a top notch job on everything else. Replace or rebuild the compressor, make sure you have new hoses and ensure everything else has been disassembled and thoroughly cleaned. It would be a shame to charge the system with R12 and then have it leak out in a few months because of a bad hose or seal.

drec02

What all parts do you have to buy to convert from R-12 to 134??? I have a 134 compressor with the lines that run from the compressor to the condensor. What kit are you talking about and what all comes in it?

jensenracing77

if it is cooling but not cooling well then it will not need 3 or 4 cans. also it is called evac and charge (short for evacuation) if you are topping it off then no need to evacuate it. how long has the charge that is in it ben in it? if it is low it has leaked out. it has either leaked at a very slow rate and after several years is now noticeable or you have a new leak that has recently developed and is leaking at a faster rate. most likely it is the compressor seal if the car sits in the winter. it will get dry and leak a small amount and after it is ran it will reseal. after several winters it will cause a problem. when you start your car in the winter turn the A/C on also for a little while to relube the seal. if you found some R12 for $20 per can i would jump on it. we sell it at work for around $85 per lb. i find the cans for around $15 from time to time at flea markets and take every one i find.

mmurphy77

Well I bought 4 cans and charged it through the LP suction and it's cold now (but not ice cold). I guess I should have put in one more can (still some 'foam' in the sight glass). I didn't want to overfill it as I did it 'blind' so I only did 4 cans. I'll give it a month or two and if it stays cold maybe add another 12.5 oz can to top ot off. Thanks for everybody's input. Additionally, I appreciate the conversion recommendations but I would rather have correct non-functioning components than modern compressors, serp belts, etc that work. I'm one of those 'overspray', 'chalk mark' guys, sorry.

mmurphy77

Yeah I found this on Craigslist here and he still has cases left so will call him again.

Joeypete

I recharged my 86 Custom Cruiser with Freeze12...it's compatible supposedly...worked great and was ice cold after that.

1969w3155

It's supply and demand which drives the price up. According to my a/c guy there is only one manufacturing plant in the U.S. for r12, and they cannot meet the demand.

oldsonharmont

I use Freeze 12 in an '82 El Camino and it works, but not as well as Freon.
Besides, I thought the production of new Freon was banned several years ago.

Lady72nRob71

Glad you got it working - hope it stays charged for a while. A/C in TX is called "life support"...
Just for a heads up, you CAN convert to 134 and have a complete stock look. Classic Auto Air can rebuild an calibrate the POA valve for 134 and rebuild original hoses for handling increased pressures. Your original compressor can be restored all the way down to the Frigidaire decal and be prepped for 134 also. It will not be cheap, but this is the route i plan in a couple years. I do prefer the original look and fit also.

Olds64

Too each his own. Just make sure you have air from 1977 in your tires.

BOOWAH

My son in law's father was a pack rat with things like that. When he was helping his dad clean out the garage he found a propane like container of R12 that was half full. He brought it over for me knowing that I have a 72 Cutlass and an 89 Caprice that have R12 systems. I have since used it to recharge both systems and the way I figure it, I can recharge many more times. Trouble is I have no hoses and my AC man plans on relocating to Florida. He won't sell the hoses and plans on taking them with him. I don't know whether the others can legally recharge an R12 system.

Olds64

Just buy yourself a set of R12 manifold gauges. They should be pretty reasonably priced since nobody "uses" them anymore.

jensenracing77

they are still used every day. they work for home A/C and all kinds of refrigerant. 502, 404A, R22, and many others. mostly the only ones it don't work on is cars that are newer than 94.

yzzerdd

Around here, the going rate is about $20/can. There is ALOT available. You can even get it in unopened cylinders. Anyhow, I wouldn't expect to spend any more than $15-$20 per can, anywhere.

I did convert an R12 system to R134a on a 1992 Dodge Dynasty. Worked great until it all leaked out. The new Cavalier uses R134a. While easier to obtain, I do not have any of the special tools to work on it, like changing hoses. I do, on the other hand, have all the guages, hoses, etc for both R12 and R134a.

Yes, AC in Texas is definitely life support. Unfortunately, my car needs a new compressor! Easy job, just 3 or 4 bolts!

--Ryan

Mike77

Charge the sight glass untill full, then stop imediately. It will work MUCH better with a full sight glass.
R-12 is not produced in Canada or USA. Lots of "drop in" refrigerants with various pro/cons. Some have a lot of Butane or Propane. Read the label. Very interesting what a leak in the interior will do if it finds an ignition source! Can you say "give me a lite"................... KABOOOM!!!!
Mike