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Electric fan/fans

Old July 19th, 2014, 03:37 PM
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Electric fan/fans

I guess I'm going to give electric fans a try on my 65, I have tried every everything I can think of to get that car to run cooler. Today it was only 80 and the car ran at 205 going down the road at 60 MPH, wanted to turn on the air but knew it would drive the temp up to 215 or so.
I have a brand new brass and copper 4 core radiator, found a brand new NOS HD w/air water pump I use a high flow 180 thermostat there are no blocks in the radiator, air condition condenser or transmission coolers and all the rubber seals are in place. I am using a NOS clutch fan (it's the only thing out there that fits) and I think it has enough slippage that it's not pulling air properly, fan is a 7 blade in a custom fan shroud, and is half in and half out of the shroud with only 1/2 clearance around it.
How much CFM rating do you need to have to cool a 350 I only have about 3 inches of clearance between the water pump and the radiator.
I have been looking at several with metal shrouds but none are the right size so I will probably make my own does anyone know why the after market cuts louvers and sometimes a bunch of holes in there shrouds, seems like that would defeat the purpose of have a shroud.
Also are any brands of these fans better than others?
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Old July 19th, 2014, 04:30 PM
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Check with universalpartsinc.com, I got a northern aluminum radiator with dual spal fans and a shroud from them.
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Old July 19th, 2014, 07:20 PM
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Just a heads up, I had a horrible experience with universal parts!
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Old July 19th, 2014, 07:25 PM
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I had no problems, ordered the parts, got them fast, installed it. Works and looks great. They even gave me a discount on wiring.
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Old July 20th, 2014, 04:48 AM
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Orderd a $900 radiator/fan package and the thing pissed all over my garage floor after pouring in a half gallon of coolent.

Got into a nasty argument with Ryan who then started swearing at me on the phone,dropped a couple of F bombs at me.

Once I told him I was ready to do what I need to do legally to get my money back then I got my refund and a email with an opology.

The radiator basically failed without ever starting the car,it just wouldn't hold any coolent. I sent him 3-4 emails which he never read so I finally called him.

Sent it back and got a Ron Davis radiator and never looked back!
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Old July 20th, 2014, 02:49 PM
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I don't need a radiator I need fans.
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Old July 20th, 2014, 03:54 PM
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I got dual Spal 3260cfm total.


[IMG]CR5026_RS1002HP by 70cutty, on Flickr[/IMG]
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Old July 20th, 2014, 06:31 PM
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I'm not sure your fans are doing too much at 60 mph on an 80 degree day. Normal 60 MPH air flow should be cooling it real well.
Are you sure you don't have another problem?
In stop and go traffic, your fan or fans should keep you from overheating.
I'm no expert though.
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Old July 21st, 2014, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by 68conv455 View Post
I'm not sure your fans are doing too much at 60 mph on an 80 degree day. Normal 60 MPH air flow should be cooling it real well.
Are you sure you don't have another problem?
In stop and go traffic, your fan or fans should keep you from overheating.
I'm no expert though.


You might not be an expert but you are quite correct.
Overheating when cruising isn't a fan problem.
It could be an airflow issue, has anything else been altered when the custom shroud was fitted. What happened to the original shroud?.


There are plenty of other causes of running hot when cruising, is your gas mileage good?, if it uses more than it used to possibly the brakes could be binding or the driveline has a drag in it.


I'm pretty sure adding fans won't fix your current problem.


Roger.
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Old July 26th, 2014, 10:17 PM
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Agree. This does not sound at all like a problem fans will correct. Either the ignition timing is retarded, or you do not have enough cooling capacity in the system.
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Old July 26th, 2014, 10:37 PM
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Be Cool Radiator and Spal fans. 180 all the time. This WILL fix your problem. I know from experience.
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Old July 28th, 2014, 04:25 PM
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I have found a fan set up that pulls 4000 CFM that will fit almost perfect. I have also acquired a 150amp alternator to upgrade the charging system.
I 'm pretty certain the problem I have is a Desert cooler radiator which has about 10 extra rows of cooling tubes and the 30 year old NOS fan clutch with a 18" 7 blade fan. What I think is going on is that radiator is rather dense and that old fan clutch doesn't have enough poop to spin that 7 blade fan, so the combo of of an over dense radiator and a 7 blade fan blocking the air flow is what's causing me problems.
The timing is good.
You can't buy a new clutch for a 65, they used a real short clutch that no one makes anymore and the original is the tiniest little POS fan clutch I have ever seen.
So this is either going to work or be a real expensive mistake.
I wish I had bought a big 2 row aluminum radiator but I didn't so now I have to make it work.
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Old July 28th, 2014, 04:48 PM
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I guess we'll see.
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Old July 28th, 2014, 10:27 PM
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What happens with the temperature in traffic?
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Old July 29th, 2014, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by need4speed View Post
What happens with the temperature in traffic?
As long as you don't turn on the air there is no problem, but always runs 25-30 degrees over the thermostat unless it's real cool out side then it runs at 185.
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Old July 29th, 2014, 05:11 PM
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Been there done that.It turns out what my problem was ,I think was the radiator cap.Before you do anything change the cap.I put a stock cap on mine.Before that it ran about 205 all the time.
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Old July 29th, 2014, 10:43 PM
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Keep us posted. I am interested in hearing how this turns out.
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Old July 30th, 2014, 03:13 AM
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Something else to consider for a fan, a good alternative is out of a Taurus or the dual fan setup from a Windstar or 4th gen F-body. They all pull over 3000CFM, have factory reliability, and are pretty easy to set up with a simple relay. You can also check out a factory Volvo relay with high and low settings as well as 2 different senders.
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Old July 30th, 2014, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Railguy View Post
Been there done that.It turns out what my problem was ,I think was the radiator cap.Before you do anything change the cap.I put a stock cap on mine.Before that it ran about 205 all the time.
railguy
Come to think of it,When my problem stopped was when I had the heads off.When I reassembled the engine I put a new thermostat in,new rad. cap(stock)and used thicker head gaskets,to lower compression so I could run pump gas.I had changed the thermostat a few times so I think I can rule that out.But I was thinking could it be something to do with the head gaskets?Maybe the wrong ones?
The reason I had the heads off was to mill the towers where the rockers bolted down.I'm using studs and not the stock set-up.The only way to get the geometry right was to lower the studs.Any way when I reassembled the engine the cooling problem was gone.I did everything I could before that nothing helped.I put a bigger radiator in (triple core) I had the triple taken out a four core put in.I even measured how much water it held before and after.I put an electric fan in that blows from the front while the stock pulls from inside.Nothing helped in the least.
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Old July 30th, 2014, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Railguy View Post
Come to think of it,When my problem stopped was when I had the heads off.When I reassembled the engine I put a new thermostat in,new rad. cap(stock)and used thicker head gaskets,to lower compression so I could run pump gas.I had changed the thermostat a few times so I think I can rule that out.But I was thinking could it be something to do with the head gaskets?Maybe the wrong ones?
The reason I had the heads off was to mill the towers where the rockers bolted down.I'm using studs and not the stock set-up.The only way to get the geometry right was to lower the studs.Any way when I reassembled the engine the cooling problem was gone.I did everything I could before that nothing helped.I put a bigger radiator in (triple core) I had the triple taken out a four core put in.I even measured how much water it held before and after.I put an electric fan in that blows from the front while the stock pulls from inside.Nothing helped in the least.
railguy
I have changed the radiator cap twice. Where did you get that cool Olds decal with the question mark? The fans and controller showed up today, I think I'm going to exchange the controller I got for a Painless wire controller that has soft start and seems to be a little more intelligent about temp control.

Last edited by jag1886; July 30th, 2014 at 03:55 PM.
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Old July 30th, 2014, 04:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jag1886 View Post
I have changed the radiator cap twice. Where did you get that cool Olds decal with the question mark? The fans and controller showed up today, I think I'm going to exchange the controller I got for a Painless wire controller that has soft start and seems to be a little more intelligent about temp control.
I had the decal made custom.I think it was $25 for 4.What pound cap do you have.Mine is 15.
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Old July 30th, 2014, 08:33 PM
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Can't a later model clutch/fan/maybe even pulley be adapted to fit on your car? Seems crazy to have to resort to converting to electric fans ( which I personally feel are inferior to a properly functioning clutch fan ) just because a replacement clutch isn't available. There's got to be an better solution.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 12:22 AM
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If the car is running hot at highway speeds fans won't help at all. You could take the fan off altogether and it probably wouldn't make any difference cruising at highway speeds.
Have you removed any air dams from under the car?, is the airflow being directed through the radiator as designed?.


The radiator cap is a quick and easy check, and it might turn out to be a cheap and easy fix, it does sound like the rest of the cooling system is in good order.


Roger.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 12:26 PM
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Originally Posted by brownbomber77 View Post
Something else to consider for a fan, a good alternative is out of a Taurus or the dual fan setup from a Windstar or 4th gen F-body. They all pull over 3000CFM, have factory reliability, and are pretty easy to set up with a simple relay. You can also check out a factory Volvo relay with high and low settings as well as 2 different senders.
I picked up this exact setup a few weeks back at the junkyard. Windstar fans and Volvo relays for 12 bucks. The motor was out so it was as easy as it could be to take it out.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 03:17 PM
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I have a feeling this is an air pressure problem. Somehow somewhere the air pressure under the hood is blocking the flow through the engine. As others have said fans don't matter at speed. It's an airflow problem.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Railguy View Post
I had the decal made custom.I think it was $25 for 4.What pound cap do you have.Mine is 15.
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I may have a couple of those made if it's ok with you (don't want to steal your idea) I a new AC Delco 15 lbs cap.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 03:49 PM
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If the car is running hot at highway speeds fans won't help at all. You could take the fan off altogether and it probably wouldn't make any difference cruising at highway speeds.
Have you removed any air dams from under the car?, is the airflow being directed through the radiator as designed?.

There are no air dams on a 65, there is a PS cooler a transmission cooler a air conditioning condenser and a very dense Desert cooler radiator. I was looking at the front of the car the other night and the air opening through the grill is very small compared to the radiator size and there is only a small opening in the bumper so air flow is somewhat restricted by the factory design. It doesn't run hot unless you turn on the AC you can drive it all day in any weather as long as it's off.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 03:52 PM
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Originally Posted by DoubleV View Post
Can't a later model clutch/fan/maybe even pulley be adapted to fit on your car? Seems crazy to have to resort to converting to electric fans ( which I personally feel are inferior to a properly functioning clutch fan ) just because a replacement clutch isn't available. There's got to be an better solution.
I already tried this, a newer clutch fan rides within a 1/8" of the radiator even with the radiator pulled as far forward as possible and it also makes the fan run to far into the shroud which screws up air flow.
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Old July 31st, 2014, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by jag1886 View Post
I may have a couple of those made if it's ok with you (don't want to steal your idea) I a new AC Delco 15 lbs cap.
Don't care at all I ripped it off from the got milk ? thing anyway.You'll get a lot of comments from the people that don't know the Olds engine is called a Rocket.Did you mean you just got a new 15 lb. cap or you just got 1?Another thing to check is your coolant it is mixed 50/50 right?if it's full strength it will not work as well.I'm really curious about this cause it sounds just like the problem I had.When it went away I had made so many changes at the same time I don't what fixed it.I put an electric fan on and it made no change.When it went away I just quit using it. A week ago I took the stock fan off and I'm going to try running just the electric one.
Keep me posted
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Old August 1st, 2014, 12:43 AM
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[QUOTE=jag1886;728656
There are no air dams on a 65, there is a PS cooler a transmission cooler a air conditioning condenser and a very dense Desert cooler radiator. I was looking at the front of the car the other night and the air opening through the grill is very small compared to the radiator size and there is only a small opening in the bumper so air flow is somewhat restricted by the factory design. It doesn't run hot unless you turn on the AC you can drive it all day in any weather as long as it's off.[/QUOTE]



It has been pointed out in many other posts, not restricted to cooling system issues, that many thousands of cars ran fine from the factory without modifications.
I would guess the standard factory setup should be fine if everything is in good working order.




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Old August 1st, 2014, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by rustyroger View Post
It has been pointed out in many other posts, not restricted to cooling system issues, that many thousands of cars ran fine from the factory without modifications.
I would guess the standard factory setup should be fine if everything is in good working order.




Roger.
You need to read all the posts. I would do that if I could buy a new HD clutch fan, no one makes them, all there are are 30 year old NOS clutches that cost $200 apiece and don't work to well because they are so old. We can't all run down to Schuck's and buy a new one.
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Old August 1st, 2014, 03:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Railguy View Post
Don't care at all I ripped it off from the got milk ? thing anyway.You'll get a lot of comments from the people that don't know the Olds engine is called a Rocket.Did you mean you just got a new 15 lb. cap or you just got 1?Another thing to check is your coolant it is mixed 50/50 right?if it's full strength it will not work as well.I'm really curious about this cause it sounds just like the problem I had.When it went away I had made so many changes at the same time I don't what fixed it.I put an electric fan on and it made no change.When it went away I just quit using it. A week ago I took the stock fan off and I'm going to try running just the electric one.
Keep me posted
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Yes I put a new cap on last winter and I have 50/50 mix in it now, I have tried a weaker mix and I even tried some of that water wetter and it made no difference.
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Old August 1st, 2014, 05:43 PM
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Did you have the engine apart?I'm still wondering about head gaskets.Like I said before this sounds exactly like the problem I had.The fan I had was a stock 4 blade non clutch.
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Old August 1st, 2014, 07:11 PM
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Did this ever get resolved??
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Old August 2nd, 2014, 01:10 AM
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Originally Posted by jag1886 View Post
You need to read all the posts. I would do that if I could buy a new HD clutch fan, no one makes them, all there are are 30 year old NOS clutches that cost $200 apiece and don't work to well because they are so old. We can't all run down to Schuck's and buy a new one.

I have read all the posts.
You said the car got hot at highway speeds, and turning the A/C on made things worse.
That says to me your problem isn't fan related, but the coolant radiator can't shift enough heat to keep things cool at highway speeds.
That could be for any number of reasons, but not the fan, I doubt if a fixed fan could shift more air than a 50 mph air blast rammed through the radiator.


I can't nip down to Schuck's either, the nearest Napa, O'Reillys, Carquest, or whatever is at least 12 hours away with current airport security.


Roger.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by rustyroger View Post
I have read all the posts.
You said the car got hot at highway speeds, and turning the A/C on made things worse.
That says to me your problem isn't fan related, but the coolant radiator can't shift enough heat to keep things cool at highway speeds.
That could be for any number of reasons, but not the fan, I doubt if a fixed fan could shift more air than a 50 mph air blast rammed through the radiator.


I can't nip down to Schuck's either, the nearest Napa, O'Reillys, Carquest, or whatever is at least 12 hours away with current airport security.


Roger.
I like that "nip down" never heard that before. Didn't notice you where from the other side of the pond.
If this was a simple problem I would have figured it out by now. It doesn't run hot at highway speeds just hotter than it should.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Railguy View Post
Did you have the engine apart?I'm still wondering about head gaskets.Like I said before this sounds exactly like the problem I had.The fan I had was a stock 4 blade non clutch.
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The engine was rebuilt a couple of years ago and I put new set of heads on it this winter it's had FelPro P?T gaskets on it with the rebuild and MrGasket gaskets the second time.
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Old August 5th, 2014, 05:29 PM
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Seen A car with shaved heads talked to the owner the only thing he could do to keep temp down was he ran an electric fan as well as the clutch fan had a toggle switch to turn on n off to keep car cool .
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Old August 6th, 2014, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by dprestia View Post
Did this ever get resolved??
Not yet it's been over 90 degrees in my garage for at least a month and I don't work out there when it's that hot, I do have almost all the parts gathered, just waiting for the controller for the fans.
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Old August 7th, 2014, 06:39 AM
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jag1886 - so you just bought electric fans - please let us know which setup/parts you finally went with. Also, do you have the OEM shroud and do the electric fans fit within that or do you replace all of it with electric fan(s) + new shroud or possibly no shroud at all... sorry if newbie questions

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