Seff

Top o' the morning, gents and fair ladies.
Symptoms:
- None of my turn signals work.
- Hazard blinker works just fine.
- When the key is turned to RUN, the turn signal fuse is fried.
- Horn doesn't work, relay clicks when I depress the horn button..
- When I put the key in the ignition, the car gives off a meek beep. This can be stopped by turning the key to RUN, or by depressing the horn button.
- I had two small silver gadgets, one of them plugged into the fuse box, the other plugged into a wire close to the steering column. The one on the fuse box rattles, assume that means it's dead.

I'm not sure where to begin.

Highwayman

Seff, the two small silver gadgets are probably the flashers. One for the turn signals and the other for the hazard flashers. I don't remember which is which at the moment. Turn on the hazard flashers that work and listen, feel the flashers to see which one is the hazard. The other will be the turn signals.

You say the hazard flashers work. The good news is the hazard flashers and turn signals share the same wiring and lights. So if the hazards all work then the wiring and lights for the turn signals will be good. The turn signal problem should be limited to the under the dash and/or the steering column.

If the horn relay is clicking I would assume the part in the steering column is good and check the relay to see if it is switching power to the horns.

The key buzzer is normal. It is to remind you not to leave the keys in the car. The buzzer is a little black box under the dash and can be removed if it annoys you.

That Wild About Cars site should have a wiring diagram if you don't already have one.

Seff

I didn't have this key buzzer until now, but if my car is magically regenerating safety features, all the better!

If a flasher is busted, will that make the car blow the fuse every time when the key is put into RUN?

Seff

I bought a new flasher and five spare fuses - put the new flasher and a new fuse in. The hazard lights still work like they should, turning the key doesn't fry the flasher or the fuse - but I still don't have turn signals.

Rickman48

At the bottom of the steering column there are various connections and plugs - make sure they are clean, straight, and plugged in all the way.

Seff

Gotcha.

rougebeats

Will the fuse blow when you try to honk the horn? That indicates a bad ground probably under the horn cap or in that area. Im not familiar with this particular model, but a short is a short. If you have problems with the signal and the horn, I would guess it to be something under your horn cap or steering wheel in proximity to your turn signal cam and horn button. Good luck and keep us posted.

Seff

Horn cap? Is that the horn relay bolted to the driver's side front fender?

rougebeats

Horn button on the steering wheel

Seff

Ahhh, yeah, I'll pop that off, then, and see what happens.

rougebeats

Has the steering wheel been changed or an aftermarket wheel been installed?

Seff

No, but the steering column is out of a '71 that I cannibalized, and said '71 had all kinds of botched repairs, weird wiring for a big stereo that's no longer there, and had generally not been properly taken care of. The '72 column was worse, though.

rougebeats

I think its safe to say I would start there. They sell turn signal cam/horn wire harnesses. Try holding the horn button down for about 4-5 seconds and immediately feel the wires and contacts. If they are warm or even really hot to the touch, you have a short (most likely in the column or under the horn button).

Seff

Will do. Having dinner at the moment, but I'll check it tomorrow.

Seff

I got the steering wheel off, looked at the turn signal switch (saw nothing obviously wrong), then took the turn signal switch out of my '72 column, with the same result - hazard lights, but no turn signal. In a moment of frustration, I started swapping out the flashers, the old one and a new one.

Old flasher in fusebox, the new flasher plugged into the wire plug = hazard lights work.
Old in fusebox, nothing in wire plug = hazard works
Old in wire, new in fusebox = no hazard
Old in wire, nothing in fusebox = no hazard
New in fusebox, nothing in wire = no hazard

Soooo, somehow I suspect this new flasher as well.

MDchanic

Sounds right to me.

Theoretically, the flashers for the signals and the 4-ways are different (signal flasher should behave differently when all bulbs aren't working at the same time, such as a burned out bulb), but either flasher should make the appropriate lights flash in either position.

- Eric

Seff

So, what you're telling me is that something is wrong with my new flasher. I'm not sure I can troubleshoot the turn signal before I locate a working flasher. Then again, if the flasher isn't making anything light up when it's in the turn signal position, then I still have a loose connection somewhere. I think.

MDchanic

You can troubleshoot it - just put a paper clip in the plug where the flasher is supposed to go (the one hanging by its wires in this case). Then, try your signal light switch and your brake lights. It won't flash, but it will go on and stay on, and you'll see that all of the parts are working.

- Eric

Seff

I shall attempt this.

Do I get a prize if I manage to burn the paperclip in two? :P

MDchanic

It'll glow a nice bright red for a while before it melts .

- Eric

Seff

It'll probably set my interior on fire, and or burn more holes in my pants.

This shall be attempted!

Allan R

Seff, flashers (just a relay) aren't expensive. Just go back and let them know it doesn't work. Just out of curiosity - why don't you pull the flashers from your 71 parst car and see if they work? Saves a whole lot of time and some $$ running back and forth.

And putting a U shaped paper clip like Eric said to trouble shoot won't melt. It might get pretty hot if you leave it energized for a long time though.

Seff

Neither of the two cars had both flashers - I used one from each on the final car, and then one of them started rattling at the same time as the turn signals quit, which prompted me to replace it.

The flashers I got WERE expensive. $40 a pop. The downside of the wages we have. :P

I wasn't as afraid of burning the clip as I was amused at the idea of electrical misadventures. Black humor is the best.

Allan R

Wow, Seff. You want to see black humor??? Check these:
http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/se...%21turn+signal less than 4.00

and rockauto:

TRIDON Part # EL12 Electro-Mechanical Flasher $5.87

What the heck kind of wages do you guys make. Sounds like 300.00/hr?? I couldn't afford to live there if a flasher costs 40.00 EACH.

Seff

$20 an hour, minimum wage. An hour's work from a mechanic nets him something like $80.

Those prices are excellent, but a majority of the savings disappear somewhere over the Atlantic, sadly. I'm in the wrong country to be driving an American car. D:

MDchanic

You could probably rig a 3-wire European flasher to work, as well, if you needed to.
Just leave the wire for the indicator light disconnected.

If the current draw from your car is wrong for the standard European signal flasher, then use a trailer towing flasher, which is unaffected by load.

- Eric

Seff

Hmm, the ones I have now ARE larger than the OEM one, and they have a "broken bulb indicator" function as well.

Allan R

You're kidding me!! We're lucky our minimum wage just got boosted to 9.40

I know about shipping. I think the true name for shipping is "Legal rape". It's one of those things that gets me upset too

HEY!! I just did a search for postal rates to Denmark from my home. You'll NEVER believe how CHEAP that would be to send from here!! International small package Air - for a small .5 lb parcel is less than 10.00

I don't have O'Reilly's close by, but do have Canadian Tire and Napa. I checked their prices and they are cheap too. I can prolly get you 2 shipped to Denmark for less than 1/2 the cost of one flasher where you are.
If you're interested LMK.

Seff

That's an awesome offer - be careful, or I'll start asking for more small stuff! Will let you know if I can't get the ones I have now to work.

The minimum wages are part of the welfare system we have. Potentially a long political discussion ahead, beware. Gas is $8 a gallon, BTW.

Allan R

The offer stands. I'd be happy to help with the small stuff that I can get a good rate on it.

$8.00/gallon? Is that 3.78L/gal or the 4.5L/ gal? Our price here (local) is 5.18 / gal (87 oct) and 5.86 / gal 91oct. Vancouver (where we're planning to move) is currently anywhere from 6.39/gal to 6.90/gal just for reg. For premium it's close to what you're paying. Shucks, just 10 years ago gas here was only 1.80/gal. See what happens when gas pumps grow up and become independent??

Seff

US gallons, the 3.78 version.

Seems I really shouldn't be bitching, given the ratio between income and gas prices. Add to it that most people over here drive something on the good side of 40 MPG.

Seff

Yeah, you guys are gonna love this. By testing the various fuse terminals in an effort to find the short in my chassis wiring, I realized that turn signals don't work unless your ignition is in RUN. Reckon I feel stupid? Both old flashers work, neither of the new ones do. Gonna go return them tomorrow.

The initial problem was caused by the resistance over the TCS solenoid being shorted, which in turn fried the fuse it shares with the turn signals, but not the hazard lights. Buzzer wasn't working because the turn signal switch wasn't properly tightened down against the steering column, due to the use of other screws. That's fixed now.

Apart from being 100% right when I told myself "I'm overlooking something really, really elemental here", I'm pretty much just relieved that it wasn't something that was actually broken. Thanks for the help, all the same. :P

Allan R

Life's full of embarrassing moments like that , but on the good side you now know something about your car that you didn't before.

Will the autoshops actually take back electrical stuff over there even after it's been installed or 'tested'? Over here, electrical sales are 'final' when you pay for them

Seff

They might frown about it, but I have my receipt. We'll see.

rougebeats

I've been watching this thread. I ran out of helpful ideas so Im glad to see a resolve....even if you had to have a "duh" moment in the process
It happens to the best of us!

Allan R

Hey Seff, what happened with the flashers? FYI, I went out to the shed and checked. I have 3 wiring harnesses c/w fuse boxes that have OEM flashers still in them.

Seff

I never got around to taking them back, due to social obligations and a bout of binge drinking. It's on todays schedule.

As for the "duh" moment, I consider it a healthy reminder of my own mortality.

Seff

They took the flashers back without further ado. He just smirked at me having struggled with the wiring in a 40 year old car. Since I don't desperately need new ones right now, I'll just pool a new set into my next large order from overseas.

Pictures of the car in question, for those interested: https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...tml#post418743