brown7373

The outer wheel bearing on my 72 Cutlass is destroyed, and the spindle now is all "grooved up". Anyone think I have any alternative but to replace the spindle?

oldspackrat

I would think replacement is in order. Disc brakes or drum & which side, driver or passenger? Many of us here have used spindles & can ship easily.

oldcutlass

I'd replace it. Those bearings need to be repacked with grease periodically.

MDchanic

Holy @*^$!

What did that sound like as it was slowly destroyed?

Definitely nothing to do but replace it.

- Eric

brown7373

It is a left front (drivers side). I was on a 4 day trip with our antique car club, traveling the back roads. At first I thought it was a loose center cap, and one was loose. But it continued and I thought it was a rattling stainless triangle wheel trim, because one definitely was loose and rattling. But it definitely sounded like something rattling around in a cap, or maybe a stone trapped between the rotor and the shield. The left front shield looked bent in toward and very close to the rotor, but nothing behind it. I bent it out. with the wheel off, there was no wobble and the hub was not hot. It continued to rattle loudly, then I would hear nothing, sometimes for a few hours. Steering was perfect, no wander, no jerking, even when it was howling. Turning or using the brakes had zero effect. Finally, on Saturday, it got worse and the car started darting left or right. I found a parking lot and pulled over and now the hub was HOT. I didn't have the right tools with me to pull the caliper and rotor, so I called AAA to tow to the hotel. I recalled AAA on Sun day morning for another tow back home, 154 miles away. Thank God I increased my AAA plan to include 200 mile towing.


Up until the end, I didn't think it was a bearing. Even when it was making the constant rattle, I could take my hands off the wheel and it drove straight as an arrow. I would have expected some pull, or a little jerking, or something. That why I thought a stone or bolt or socket was rattling around.


Anyone have a good spindle? I can order new one but a good used would work. 1972 stock, no dropped spindles.

oldspackrat

I might have one, give me a day or so to check.

MDchanic

I will keep these symptoms in mind, as I have never destroyed a wheel bearing before, and I will be checking my wheel bearings in the next few weeks, as I think I looked at them a couple of years ago, but then, maybe that was a different car...

- Eric

Chesrown 67 OAI

the only issue is that the bearing must slide-fit over the spindle. This applies to both outer and inner spindle bearings. Grooves dont hurt a bit because the bearing isnt suppose to do much , if any, turning on the spindle surface. I have polished it smooth with 180 or even 220 emery strip cloth and filed any burrs off before polishing. when the bearing slides smoothly into place on the spindle, youre good to go. You may want to try it before replacing spindle? It all depends on whether you can get any burrs/ridges smoothed out. You didnt say whether you had to cut/split the old bearing off the spindle or not? I suspect that if the bearing center came off the spindle without a lot of work, then you dont have enough damage to warrant replacing the spindle. However if the spindle bearing surface looks black/blue like it had been extremely hot and burned, then replacement is in order.
MOO
Tweed ( i'm from "old school" that would rather fix or repair than replace, saving any expense, if possible)

brown7373

So maybe I don't replace the spindle. The bearing center came right out with no effort or binding. Most of the rollers were in the center of the rotor. I used a little emery cloth and it smoothed out and shined up, but still has grooves. It never got so hot that I burned my hand and it wasn't discolored. Any other opinions on reusing the spindle with grooves (maybe it would play music)? The bearing does not hang up on the grooved area.


I bought the whole set up to switch from power drum to power disk. The person I bought from even included new bearings & seals. I do remember noting that I wasn't familiar with the brand of bearings, but they looked okay. I'm not sure where they were manufactured. I packed the bearings, torqued per spec. to seat the bearings, backed off and then finger tightened, inserted the cotter in the first looser keyway. I have done bearings dozens of times in 50 years or so and never had a bearing fail, so I wasn't sure what it sounded like either. It started on Thursday, off and on, continued off and on Friday and Saturday, some 250 miles. It got very bad on Saturday, and started jerking, so I pulled over. and called AAA.


I am replacing all the bearings on both sides with Timkin bearings that I ordered from RockAuto. Incidentally, the inner bearing on that side looks fine, and was holding grease just like it should. Cheap Chinesium Bearings (if that is what I had) scare me, and I don't want another failure down the road.

MDchanic

I would add that, while it is true, on the one hand, that the bearing must be able to slip on, on the other hand, it must fit on the spindle without noticeable play. If your spindle is too badly beat-up, then by the time you've gotten it smoothed down, you may find that, in one dimension, it's a bit too small.

A good idea, and worth a try, but that spindle looks pretty bad to me, so I wouldn't have high expectations.

- Eric

brown7373

Yeah Eric, as I think about it, I probably will not risk another failure and replace it. Too much play will probably result in it breaking again.

MDchanic

Nothing lost from seeing how a new bearing feels on the spindle after you clean it up a bit.

Also, you can run on the old one while you wait to find a good new one, if the old one is within reason.

- Eric

droldsmorland

Though Ive seen worse be put back in to service Id replace the spindle. Its a safety thing. You dont want the bearing inner spinning on the spindle. MAW do the ball joints. MAW do both sides BJs and bushings...Let the MAWs commence!
BDI(dot com) will have USA made bearings and seals. Just have to ask. They will ship them to you. Repack bearings every 5 years on these cars that sit, and especially as part of a long road trip maintenance task...but you already know that.

65Delta

That's EXACTLY what happened to me. Sounds like a mismatched Chinesium outer race (cup) mixed with a different inner race (cone).
https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...brake-kit.html

Chesrown 67 OAI

YES to TIMKEN BEARINGS -- Youre helping to pay my pension. I was a roller grinder at TIMKEN for almost 32 years!! Never use nothing the best when it comes to bearings for your ride!!

Chesrown 67 OAI

Not taking anything to chance with a new spindle and new TIMKEN bearings and seals

65Delta

I'd recommend preloading the new wheel bearings by tightening to 5-7.5 in-lbs or so while rotating the wheel. I did a deep dive when I replaced my wheel bearings and found Timken charts, showing max bearing life was 0.002-0.004" positive preload.

oldcutlass

I always put a small preload on wheel bearings. Make sure they are packed full of grease.

MDchanic

While I can't cite you chapter and verse, different year ranges have slightly different instructions with regard to front wheel bearing preload setting - I just follow whichever instruction is in the relevant year's Chassis Service Manual.

- Eric

droldsmorland

X20 on USA made Timkens...no chineasium junk in a classic.

brown7373

As Eric stated, procedure may differ from year to year. I followed the 1972 Service Manual, which states,
1. While turning wheel, tighten nut to 30 ft. lbs.
2. Back off Nut 1/2 turn.
3. Retighten the nut finger tight and install retaining ring or cotter key if possible.


NOTE: If unable to install retaining ring or cotter key, back off nut (not to exceed 1/24 of a turn) until tabs on clip align with serration on the nut.


4. Front wheel bearings, when properly adjusted, will have .001" to .008" end movement.


That is a quote from the 1972 Service Manual.

65Delta

The '69 and '72 service manuals say the same thing but I opted to go with timken's recommendation. 0.008" seems like quite a lot for end play. The rear wheel bearings have changed since '71-'72. It seemed reasonable to use the latest recommendation for the fronts as well.

brown7373

I also have a 70 Pontiac Bonneville convertible. That Service Manual also says that "under no circumstances should the bearing be even finger tight."