Tony72Cutlass'S'

Hello All,

So here is the first post in my attempt to start rebuilding/transforming my current sorry excuse for a suspension system into what it should have been from factory.

Be advised, it will take elbow grease, sandpaper, and probably a couple pairs of channel locks. Do i know what i'm getting into? Probably not BUT HERE WE GO!!!!

First, i started off yesterday by greasing everything up with WD-40. From the lower shock bolts down to the last fittings and sway bar connections.

Today, we Begin. Here is my suspension. All original, (except for the link).

Next, i removed the link, sway bar bushings and complete sway bar to be wire brushed and painted.

The lower shock nuts were a breeze.. (2 hours later). I finally got the two lower shock bolts out.. On to the top shock nut (which would consume the remainder of the afternoon. I First tried this. Gripping the shock bar with all my might with a vice-grip.



But after mercilessly trying for over an hour. I gave up and pulled out the angle grinder. I cut the top bolt at 30degrees from the vertical. Smacked it with a BFH. AND THE SHOCK CAME OUT.

Tony:1
Shock:0



And now it's 9:00pm. I wirebrushed the sway bar and gave it a coat of nice black paint. And now i am off to canadian tire to get a proper welding mask. Stay tuned for more laughs, and thanks for reading.

Cheers,

Tony

Lady72nRob71

Ha, ha - you had the same upper shock nut fun as I had!
However my lowers popped right out with the impact wrench without issue...
Oh, BFH's rule!
Sounds like you are taking a trip into the unknown, too!
Go ahead - pull those fenderwells.

Allan R

Wowsers Tony, I thought mine was rough. But like you said, it had been sitting in the trees for years. I'm hoping this comes across right. If those control arms are as corroded as they look, you might be better off getting replacements? Chances are the bushings and control arms are all one piece now. I know some of the guys close to you would have some; Jensenracing77 or Oldspackrat. You said you have a cross border pickup, you could even get these from john in medford (2blu442)

On the other side, just overtighten the bolts and bust them. It takes about 2 minutes. I like your approach to getting the upper shock nuts out. Mine were easy, took all of 10 seconds with a deep 9/16 and air ratchet. If you have deep sockets, they are very handy for lots of things. Prefer the 6 point ones. That and box end wrenches.

Ok, I'll bite. What you welding? Ah, just remembered you have a cowl rust issue.

BTW, did you order replacement inner liner shields too? Those ones look like they've seen better days, and you're going to probably pull the inner liners to get more working room, right? You can get all new replacement body bolts at Partsource. Get new mounting clips too. The PS is easier than the DS to get out. They both come out better if you drop the rear first.
On the PS, it's just the liner bolts, plus the charcoal cannister mount has to come out.
On the DS you have to take out the battery tray and unclip the wire harness holders too. The battery tray is a beeatch if the bolts and nuts are rusted. If they are, you will need someone to help you because it's darn near impossible to get the leverage you need while holding a wrench underneath. + you don't want to scratch up your new paint job.
Tony, run! Run fast! Run far. Don't listen to the evil dark side...Wear a metal foil scull cap to ward off the insane voices that suggest you 'may as well' take the next thing apart! Master Kenobi will protect you from the insidious dark lord Rob......

I LOVE IT!! Another one falls prey to the epic front end rebuild... Relax Tony it gets much worse...then it gets much better. We will be here every step of the way to help you curse the day you started this project. Just kidding. Seeing the end results today, I have to say I'm very proud and happy with the way things have turned out. You will too!

BTW it looks like you're doing the brakes just in time. Those shoes look like they're shot. The wheel cylinder looks good though. Photo everything, then pull them and bag them. Label everything!!

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Hello All,

As promised, here is a parts list of what i have purchased in terms of suspension. I think i did pretty well in terms of getting a good deal on parts.

droptopron

I've never heard of Mevotech. Does the box say where they are manufactured? How do the parts look so far?

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Says they're made in taiwan, for the price i wasn't about to expect made in USA parts, but they're leaps and bounds ahead of my current suspension..

There is a picture i uploaded of the link kit above. The parts and balljoints actually look pretty good so far. I'll see how the fit is when i install them in the upcoming weeks.

DJS70cutlass

To anyone attempting to remove hopelessly rusted upper shock nuts try this.

Simply use a 14mm deep socket and about a 3 foot extension and pound it on the nut then push and pull the extension until the shock breaks. As a auto tech for 15+ years I've watched so many people get there a**es kicked by these

I also think you'd be better off with new control arms. I got all 4 this year from OPG. They looked great and installed even better.

As far as Mevotech, have used their products and generally have been satisified with them.

Lady72nRob71

NOW you tell me....
Sounds like a neat trick. Can't wait to do the next front end so i can try that!

Wait - what did I just say??

Allan R

Tony - nice price list. That's about 1/2 of what I paid for the same kind of parts. I probably would have stayed with Raybestos though and cancelled the Mevotech. (sounds like the name of the high preist IMOTEP on The Mummy series.

Rob - another front end build? Sounds good - I've got a line on a VC that I'm seriously thinking about. If it's not that, I'll look for a vert - 70/71/72. Gotta have a matching stable mate for my car.

BTW re: shocks. When I took my old ones out I noticed that I could compress them and they would stay compressed. Thought that was odd. When I was installing the new ones I noticed that they would compress, but then they extended to full height again right away. Does that mean that my old shocks were just along for the ride?

Tony72Cutlass'S'

So mevotech is good? That's great to hear.

I also agree with you and Allan, I'm going to be hopefully getting some control arms from a fellow member here on CO.

I'm think I'll clean, paint, and install all necessary hardware on the new control arms before I even take the old ones out. The just do the swap one afternoon.

Question, since I'm getting new control arms, will I need to redo the shims on the upper control arm?? My shims look really corroded, where can I get replacements and/or what can I use.

Allan R

Tony, for right now just take them out as a unit and tape/label them. The corrosion is only on the top, not in between the shim plates. You need to have the shims in the same exact location and order as when they came out. When you get the wheel alignment done in the spring or this winter, the shop will put in new shims when they do the work. Specify you want new shims. BTW, you might have to take in your CSM to show them the alignment specs - on cars this old, most shops don't have that info.

BTW, that's a great idea to take out the old CAs and just put in the rebuilts. It WILL save you time. The thing that will NOT save you time is getting out the UCA shaft bolts. They are a royal PITA! And you're are probably well rusted in there. You might need to really soak them with penetrating oil - not WD40 - to help get them out. My old ones are available if you need them. Try for new though that way you know they aren't stressed.

DJS70cutlass

Yup, if they had that little resistance to your hand moving them, you can imagine how much they slowed down the weight if the suspension parts

DJS70cutlass

I wouldn't worry about it, there's FAR cheaper stuff out there.

All the new arms I've seen come complete, no assembly or painting nessessary.

The shims are available at Carquest, in 3 different thicknesses that I can't recall right now.

Allan R

DJ - Tony's getting 'good quality replacement' which are "new" to him. The ones in his car are very badly corroded, so his plan is actually a really good one. Plus, 100.00 for 4 good condition Control Arms + bushings is way cheaper than buying new ones. I know the new ones come loaded with all new bushings and are direct bolt in, but cost is also an issue for Tony - he's a young gun and is also a hands on kind of guy. I know you will understand. FWIW I looked at new control arms, but mine really just needed a cleaning, paint and new bushings.

Great information! thx

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Thanks! Reason why i had to cancel the raybestos is no matter how many times i would order the balljoints, RA would cancel the order on me saying "sorry we dont carry those", Then why do you have them relisted on your website every 48 hours!

Truth be told, i went back and forth with a couple sales reps, and they said that Mevotech is the next best option, since i didnt want to mix and match balljoints, i wanted to go with one brand all around.

That sounds good, i will remove them and see what the condition is, Good to know they are available online too!

I will definitely bring in my CSM when my car is being inspected by the license bureau as well as alignment. I want everything done as per spec, hopefully the alignment is the only thing i'll have to get outsourced to a garage. I really dont like people fiddling around with my car no matter how qualified they might me.

My policy is that if i install it, and i torque it, and i certify it. Then if it breaks or blows then it's 100% my own fault. And i'd rather do something 50 times over than chase someone down for doing something wrong.

Sounds great, as i said before, i didnt want to mix and match, i'd rather go with one brand all around. (everything so far is MEVOtech) all except for the shocks, those are gas charged ACDELCO. I wanted to go OEM on those because they were a good price.

All new/old parts are new to me! No matter how rusted or stripped or cracked. I'll find some way to fix them. But Allan warned me in advance that it would be much easier to work my CA's before i put them in the car. That way i can paint them without rushing and get a nice finish on the parts.

Next on the suspension adventure, Cleaning all that darned gunk off my front frame! I think i'm going to start with a paint scraper, then bolt down a wirebrush to my angle grinder and go wild.

droptopron

OPG's stock replacements are pretty costly. Another alternative if you are going new is a set up like this. I have not used these but the price is pretty reasonable.

http://eastcoastchevelle.com/productsearch.php

Part Number: CTA722

it makes sense to upgrade if you are changing them. of course a good used set will have you money ahead and be fine for most applications.

Allan R

Everytime I compare prices for parts, OPG seems to be the highest (on average) right across the board, then Year One, Fusick and Parts Place. Those are the big 4 I look at, but there are lots of others like Supercars Unlimited, Steele Rubber products, H&H, ILT etc that are pretty competitive for the business. When pricing is pretty even I usually go with whoever gives the best shipping deal.

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Definitely!

So far I've bought most of the parts I need from the folks on this site. Save the expendables and felts and such.

Suspension update, I anxiously await my control arms. They will be stripped, sandblasted, painted ( maybe powedercoated ) then installed.

Should I be worried about control arms bolting up properly? Anyone ever have to take a BFH to get new control arms installed? The originals seem to be in there with quite tight tolerances...

Lady72nRob71

You are not done yet? hehe...

Never had to BFH the control arms, but it is a tight fit. A rubber mallet can tap them into place. A screwdriver can help line the holes up.
Use a little SILICONE lube on the rubber to get them to slide into the frame mounts. NEVER use petroleum lube on rubber, unless you like perpetual squeaks...

Tony72Cutlass'S'

What!

Really??? Is that why the bushings in all my cars sqeak?!

I've been using wheel bearing grease on everything for the past 5 years. There's another one for the notebook...

Allan R

If you are going to sandblast and powdercoat them that's a great way to go. I didn't do it because out here powdercoating is still pretty pricey. At $70.00 per control arm, I decided that POR15 was a better cost effective way to go. And any scuffs that happen can easily be touched up. $300.00 inc tax vs 35.00 for POR? No brainer. Probably like you, I do have to be aware of how much I spend on some things. To me, painting/powdercoat was a low priority item.

Naw, with new bushings the CA's will be a 'little tight' but I found that putting the rear in first and wiggling the front worked just fine. I didn't even have to use a rubber mallet. If you need a lube to help out, have you heard of "magic lube'?


I haven't tried this stuff, but it's supposed to be rubber friendly. You could probably also try some silcone based graphite lube - shouldn't hurt the rubber.

Like what Rob said though, use a drift or long screwdriver to help hold one in position while you do the other. After that it's really easy to feed the bolt. REMEMBER, you only tighten it a bit - maybe 20 ft/lbs for now. When the car goes back on the ground, that's when you finish the torquing. If you do it while the car is in the air, your ride height may be affected.

re: powdercoating. That may affect the bushing holes. Have the powdercoat shop tape off the 'inside' of the CAs so the coating doesn't create binding when the bushings go in. They will take the tape off before baking it. For me, I just lightly sanded the inside of the bushing seats to make sure the bushings would seat right. Surprisingly even a small amount of paint will affect how easy the bushings go in and seat.

Allan R

Forgot to add something Tony. If your CA bolts were anything like the CAs, I'd chuck them and replace them. If the mount area has a lot of rust, when you grind it off that might also weaken the area where the bolt hole is a bit. You can't hurt it by using a good sized washer or two (at least 1/8" thick) to keep the bolt head from pulling into the mount when you torque it.

Lady72nRob71

That very well could be the reason. Silicone is the only way to go on rubber.
Also, when you get the arms almost there, use screwdrivers through the holes to hold them before getting the bolts lined up. Just because you pound them into place, it does not mean they will just stay in place and not fall down. Mine did just that...

Allan R

I guess I was just lucky. I inserted the rear arm of the CA and then wiggled the front in till the holes lined up. Popped the bolt in and gave it a tap with my hammer. Budda bing, budda boom, done. Then gently tapped the rear with my hand till it lined up Bolt slipped right in and tapped into place like it was supposed to. Really went easy and only took about a minute to do each bolt. I thought it was going to be harder but it wasn't. And I'm not just saying this to make you think all of them go that easy. Hope yours does though.

Tony, one more thing to remember. The bolt head MUST be to the front of the car. The nut goes to the rear - both LCAs ok?

Now as to the real reason the suspension was squeakin... you gotta find a room buddy, not a car. Much more comfy and you can also get one of those 'vibrating' beds for added fun and excitement

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Why else would i opt for keeping the bench seat rather than going for buckets! I removed the passenger side seatbelts so the ladies would have to sit next to me. Heh!

Onto Continuing the suspension/adventure!

Here is a picture of my cutlass in it's paint drying position.
I decided to change the oil today since my car is going into storage soon. Great thing about the cutlass 's' model for the 72 model year. I dont have the jack the car up to change the oil!!! My oil pan fits right underneath with a nice wrench comes right off.



I started cutting out old metal from my dash, before it looked quite horrible, at least now all the scale is gone and i can safely cut out the rest in one sheet to put in the new dash. I will be replacing from the vinyl next to the steering wheel all the way up to underneath the windshield wiper arms.



Here is another picture i took of my car. The paint isint perfect, n'or is it buffed yet. I'm hoping some wax and my buffing wheel will bring it out to a nice gloss. For doing it myself though, i dont think its too shabby.



On a side thing for my list of things to do.
I shall be working on restoring my sill plates. They look really nasty. Any tips on cleaning aluminum up? Steel wool and windex? What will bring it back to a nice shine??



As for my control arms, i do havea nice rubber mallot i can use to tap in the arms. I found a sandblaster i bought from princess auto in my shed. I'm hoping to pull that out once i get them next week and bead blast em' and paint them so they can cure over the weekend.

I need to get some of that magic Lube, even if i dont use it on my bushings. Looks like an awesome conversation starter to keep in my glovebox

Allan R

Oh my! Tony, you seriously need to get more space to work with What is that? Maybe 10,000 sq ft?
I know you're replacing the grills on your car with the 442 ones. Hang onto those ones you have - they are 1971 but they are made of metal, not plastic. The good thing about them is they don't bend like the plastic ones. The bad thing is once they are damaged they are near impossible to fix

Hey! I see you have the B85 belt molding on the drivers door! Do you also have the piece for the rear and ther other sides? Since it's original, I'd love to see how it is fastened to the door. Any chance you're going to take it up to polish + put in new window fuzzies?

No offense bud, but that still looks horrible. I'm glad you have the ambition and skills to deal with it! What vinyl are you talking about? By any chance are you talking about the dash pad, or are you talking about the sound insulation on the inside of the firewall?

Those sill plates have definitely seen better days. You might be able to bring up the shine using various grades of steel wool. On the surfaces that are flat and easy to get to, I would use some wet sandpaper - start with 220 and go to 600 (use lots of water to keep the grit from clogging) to quickly get rid of the imperfections as much as possible. When you're done you can use aluminum polish and a buffing wheel on your bench grinder to really bring out the shine. Be careful with the fisher emblem. I looked at mine (they are new GM ones I bought back in 86) and the emblem is glued on. Yours looks like it might be riveted? If that's the case, just be super carefull drilling out the rivets.




Nice! Sand shouldn't be too expensive. Wish I had one of those. When you blast the parts, its still a good idea to go over them lightly with some sandpaper to smooth out the small pits left by the blaster. Use some high build epoxy primer to help with that before painting.

Coming along nicely bud, keep up the good work.

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Actually that's one of the vacant lots that my buddy has, i think he has 100 000 sq feet in total. Until someone moves in there (give or take a month) i'll have the opportunity to work on my car in the warmth of the garage.

That sounds fancy! What's a B85 belt moulding? If you mean the seatbelts attached to my roof, i totally have those installed. I doubt they've ever been touched too. The stickers look pretty new.

Sorry i meant to say dash pad! The piece i got goes all the way from insdie the dash pad down to below the wipers. It's exactly what i need, mine is completely rotten and not worth saving...

That's why i'll be cutting it all out When i was in college, i did most of the tubular welding for our SAE Formula competition cars. I'm used to welding thin-ish gauge metal. This is much thinner, i'm hoping to really take my time and tack as i go along. I shall post progress as it comes.

They're definitely rivited in there! The rivets almost look like tiny nails... I'll have to inspect some more tonight, Probably take a piece of really soft steel wool to it first to clean off all the excess grime.

Also, i'm lucky to have taken the picture from far away, those 71' grilles look absolutely awful up close. When the previous owner "tried" to repair them, he botched all the mounting tabs and drilled right into the body of the grill..

After going through the process of my 4-4-2 grilles, i learnt patience in dealing with 40 year old plastic. I had to keep a torch near the grill and lightly sweep it across the plastic that was warped so it would straighten out. I can't wait to paint my stone shield and install them over the winter.

Allan R

No, that's not it Tony. The B85 is the wide stainless molding that's attached to the window fuzzy on the drivers door. Does the other side have them too? You're missing the one on the DS rear. There is a special substraight that attaches it to the car as well

These are on ebay all the time. When you go to take it out, you will find it's made up of 3 main pieces. the pad, the lower dash and the glovebox. To get the pad off, you pretty much have to take the dash apart. There are around 8 nuts that have to be undone from the backside to get it off. This is in the 72 Assembly Manual. I have to take mine out too, but only to install some options. Get ahold of Eric, Scott, Joe or John. They probably have a good pad you can get shipped to your US mailbox relatively cheap. Seeing as yours is toast, you can be destructively creative when you take it out.

I don't know if you've thought about something like this: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/70-72-Cutlass...item53e712f0ab I just threw it in here as an interest item. According to the ad, it covers any cracks in an existing dash, but is not the actual pad itself. If it's just plastic, it might cheapen the look of the car somewhat.

70cutt

Tony I have the same looking sill plates and dash. I have had alot of luck polishing chrome with the DULL side of aluminum foil. Fold it up and make it into a pad, dip it into water, and press it onto the sill to fill in the grooves. Use it as a sanding block. Use it on the underside of the sill before attacking the face with whatever you end up using. Aluminum foil is very soft and you dont run the risk of scratching your chrome with it since its softer than steel, unlike using sandpaper or other abrasives, but still removes oxidation and grime and polishes. And when mixed with water a chemical reaction happens as you rub it which becomes its own buffing compound. Just keep the foil damp and be sure you are using the DULL side of the sheet. You should be able to buff it all without removing your logos I would think, maybe use a little tape for protection while buffing the metal.

Hope this helps. This method will work on any of your exterior molding as well. Just, as with anything, do a sample in an inconspicuous place first.

Also, my dash is eaten up as well, did you just find a parts car dash piece for replacing yours or are you going to fabricate it?

Allan R

What a cool way to polish. I'll try it with my B85 moldings and see how they come out.

70cutt

I hope it works well. sanding or steel wool will physically scratch off rust, pitting, grime, etc. While also scratching the chrome itself. The foil shouldnt scratch your chrome. Just be careful it doesnt have sharp edges from folds or crinkled areas. It could potentially leave a small scratch. Use masking tape to cover anything you dont want to polish then wash with clean water when you are done and a soft rag.

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Wow! Thanks, that sounds like a great idea! I'll try it tonight, I'm still on my way home from work.

I got a dash from Joe, originally I tried fabricating one, but my upper dash is COMPLETELY RUSTED, so I had to find someone with a parts car that had one.

If you need one, contact Eric, say I sent you over because he also replied to me and said he had a nice dash piece for sale. Eric is jensenracing btw.

Allan,
The passenger side definitely had it too, I had no idea that was an option!!

I have a whole box of chrome from the previous owner I havnt opened yet, do you have a picture of the rear piece I should be installing??

I wish I could upload a picture now, but alas I'm on the train on the way home!

Allan R

sorry for the poor quality of pic, this is what it looks like. Took this on the PS but you get the idea; its not attached to the car, just laying on top of the sill. Look for it in your box of parts. Also look for the substraight it gets attached to. The shapes should give them away. BTW I'm going to try that aluminum foil trick on polishing this up and see how it works. The scratches are a little on the deep side, but I did manage to find a complete set.

70cutt

Allan R

70cutt,
I don't really need to do that. The stainless in not mounted on the car, it's just placed there loosely for this shot. I can bring it in from outside and try it free hand.

Allan R

Well I just tried that aluminum polish trick on one of my B85 rear moldings. Have to say that on the + side it does take off some of the tarnish, but not a lot. I used some 600 wet sandpaper on the same area and it cleaned up about 300% more, but it's still slightly 'spotty'. Tried to get some pics, but they are a little on the blurry side even with the macro on. I think these will clean up better if I use a buffing wheel on the grinder and various degrees of cutter and polish.
This is 'before' anything was done. Keep in mind this is a 39 year old OEM part that was heavily weathered. It is very dull, very rough to the touch and has surface gunge, with some light scratching


This is after the foil and 600 grit wet sandpaper. The surface is very dull, but very smooth. It needs more work but with a buffing wheel and jewellers rouge I think it will clean up to showroom condition. While the foil does work a bit, it needs help from other sources to really make this piece pop. The plan is to try again. If it deteriorates to a worse condition, I can have this restored using 'chrome quality' powdercoating.

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Wow! I think that makes a big difference! I'm not sure how to buff chrome/aluminum, but it seems that silverware polish works well..
I'm worried about wet sanding chrome... my front bumper REALLY needs some attention. Any suggestions? I kind of want to make it last until i get it replated. When i got the car, the rear bumper had a huge hole, so i got an OEM replacement (Another tony's new/old part special) from a french farmer locally for 60 bucks. It's not perfect, but it's doing the job!

I'm not working on the car tonight, but working on trim instead.

I took the sill plates and tried cleaning first with windex, then with aluminum foil. I kept one of the sills to use as a control for gauging how good the cleaning is going. Here is my progress.

Tony72Cutlass'S'

Also! I found this today! What the heck is it??

it seems to have my interior colour code on it (954)

Also, it has my upper and lower paint code (Bamboo, #81)

70cutt

Cool to see your results. The foil isn't as aggressive as sandpaper for sure, but with elbow grease it will take it down to a nice finish. Those may just be very tarnished. Silver polish could be a possible additive to use for buffing the chrome. Drip rails, and a lot of other exterior trim would benefit from a good polish too. I have heard diet coke used with aluminum foil works also.

alek72us

Thats you build sheet. ur lucky u found it. alot of people dont.