CyberCholo

Hey guys,

I've got my **** together and going in a better direction than last year, and its time to start getting positive and spending my time on productive things, the weather is getting nicer and I wan't to start digging into my 73 Omega and getting her going.

Its leaking brake fluid at a slowish rate, I'm sure the booster needs to be replaced, but I imagine the master cylinder is no good too, eventually I lose power assist on the brakes and I gotta really hammer them, and imo the car is not safe to drive like this, as I don't think its possible to completely lose the brakes but still, and it seems like a cheap and easy job, but I'm a bit confused with my options. Maybe some are meant for drums and others for discs?

Heres the second cheapest one that is new and not a reman
http://www.summitracing.com/int/part...le/model/omega
this one I'm leaning towards because its one of the cheaper options and the picture matches the one I have now and it seems like a good middle ground, I am pretty broke.
http://www.summitracing.com/int/part...le/model/omega
this one looks weird and totally different
http://www.summitracing.com/int/part...le/model/omega
this is the one with the bigger bore, does that increase braking power? I have 4 wheel drums at the moment and wouldn't mind getting things better until I can afford to swap them over to discs
http://www.summitracing.com/int/part...le/model/omega
this is the most expensive and I can't see any reason to buy it, and its only a 1 inch bore?
http://www.summitracing.com/int/part...le/model/omega

Thanks guys!

CyberCholo

Also, does anyone know where I can get a good brake booster, and how hard is the job etc? I just checked Summit Racing and it seems they only have master cylinders, is the brake booster probably ok if the brakes work fine when the fluid is full but its just leaking? I'd like to be safe when it comes to brakes haha.

76olds

If you really have to push hard or hammer on the break to get it to stop, then your booster is the problem. A leaking master or line or cylinder you would have a spongy pedal that would eventually go easy to the floor. The booster isn't difficult to change at all with the ratchet wrenches today. Match up with what you have IMO. You would have the 1 1/8 master cylinder, If the vacuum is good from the intake to the booster and the pedal isn't hard to push..... then just fix the leaks and bleed

CyberCholo

Awesome thanks for the help, a friend pointed out that the booster was leaking when I first bought the car now that I think about it, but I never really noticed it myself for some reason.

Can I use a 73 Nova brake booster or is it unique for the Oldsmobiles? I can't seem to find much googling for an Omega booster but I'm probably better off hitting the classifieds here for a good used one I guess. These are the Nova ones I found I was thinking about going with the cheapest one, or do you think I'd be better off buying the brake booster that comes with a master cylinder already from this site?

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...,parttype,1884

Are those prices reasonable? Like I said I'm pretty broke so if I could find a good used one for cheaper I'd rather go with that, or is this one of those things where I'm better off dropping the money on something brand new?

Also I don't have any ratchet wrenches, although I've got a few of those wrenches with the different sized sockets on each end, I dunno if those will help, but I'll have to make a mental note to grab some cheap ones, or perhaps my Grandpa has a few.

Oh yeah, and also I've never bled brakes before, is it pretty straight forward?

MDchanic

First, why are you searching for ordinary auto parts at Summit? Your local auto parts store probably has these in stock.

Since you are looking at Cardone, here's Cardone's page.

The right Cardone M/C for your car is the 10-1505 or th 13-1505.

The right Cardone M/C-booster combo is 50-1111

The right Cardone booster is 54-81111

Here is NAPA's page on boosters and NAPA's page on M/C's.

- Eric

CyberCholo

Thanks for the help

I try to avoid the local auto parts stores if I can help it, in Canada they mark up everything VERY heavily, especially Lordco, so they can play that they are giving you a discount when really after the "discount" you are still paying a shitload. I get a 15% discount or something like that through my mother's work and when I went to buy a carb for my Monte even after the discount it was still 150 dollars more than it was on Summit after shipping charges and exchange rate.

I have had Lordco quote me 35 dollars for an alternator belt for my Omega, I laughed and walked out, I will for sure try them to see if I can get it right away, but I like to go in there knowing how much it costs online first.

Thank you for the help its much appreciated, since my dad has passed away about a year and a half ago, and my grandpa not long after I don't really have anyone in person I can go to about this, it seems everyone in my generation is completely useless when it comes to cars and general mechanical knowledge. You guys on the internet are a godsend.

Should I replace the MC when I replace the booster too?

Edit:I think I'm going to go with the top option on this page, 89 cad with a 21 core charge seems alright, unless you guys think I should do the MC at the same time

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...,parttype,1884

MDchanic

Wow. Holy crap. That sucks.

This stuff's dirt cheap down here.

Guess that's why they call it the "Go to the States Tax."

That being said, since you live in Vancouver, can't you just drive down to Washington early in the morning, buy the parts, and install them in the parking lot, so you've got nothing to show when you go through Customs?



I'm really sorry to hear that.
It's great to be able to hear (and ignore ) advice from your father and grandfather, and it's a real shame that they can't be here to help you.
My grandfather's been gone for 25 years now, and he was a rotten SOB in a lot of ways, and I still miss him, and would love to be able to get advice from him.

I think I speak for all of us when I say we will all do what we can to help you get this car going the best and cheapest way possible.



Okay, here is the important question, or, more broadly, what is wrong with your brakes?

If you have brake fluid leaking from anywhere near the master cylinder, it is a pretty safe bet that your M/C is bad. The major failure mode of a master cylinder is to have the seals start to leak, so that brake fluid leaks out the back of the unit. It can then leak down the outside front of the booster, or run into the booster, and leak out the bottom of the booster.
Either way, the problem is the M/C.

If your booster is bad, then either it will leak vacuum or it won't boost.
If it's leaking vacuum then your car will idle like crap, but if you pull the booster hose and put your finger over it, the idle will smooth right out.
If it's not boosting, you will know because the brakes will feel hard.

Once you have checked and decided which is bad (or both), then you can proceed to the next step of deciding which to get.

It is okay to pull and plug the booster hose and take a drive around the block without the booster, as long as you've got a strong leg. If the brakes aren't much different without the booster, then you know it's not working well.

If the base of the M/C is wet, or the fluid keeps going down, but you can't tell where it's going (no leaks or wet spots on the lines or wheel cylinders or under the car), then the M/C is bad, period.



Figure out what you need, then check around for price and quality.

Although it is almost always better to buy a rebuild if money is tight, in your case, considering shipping, you might do better buying outright to avoid sending the core back.

Keep us posted, and keep asking questions, especially if we don't explain things well enough.

- Eric

76olds

Eric's got it all covered. Awesome advice with parts #s etc , You have your ground work all laid out for you now. Use his advice and save yourself a lot of $$$. That information is like money in the bank for ya !!!

CyberCholo

Thank you!

I am close to the border but do not have a passport, and the Omega is my only vehicle at the moment but it is not insured, I have to pay a few hundred bucks before I can put a temp permit on it or anything, and if I did get my passport I dunno if I could cross the border, I have a charge on my record but it is something that is not even illegal in Washington (Legal handgun stored outside of a safe)

Hmm, maybe thats why I've been having a bit of an issue getting the idle perfect, it doesn't idle bad by any means, but if the brake booster is leaking fluid I Imagine it is leaking vacuum as well.

As far as I can remember the MC seems to be sealing well, I've refilled it a few times and it never seems to be wet or have brake fluid around it, but I will double check for sure.

When the MC is fully topped up the brakes work perfectly, not a problem. But as I drive I lose fluid and once it gets below a certain point it does not boost well or at all and the brakes go seemingly full or mostly manual and I need to really put the pedal all the way down just to get some braking force, idling at a red light requires me to really put my leg into it to keep it in place, sometimes the brake light will come on if it is very low, but if I top off the MC everything seems to go back to normal. I haven't really checked for wet spots but I will check the MC tomorrow and report back, but I'm almost certain its the booster but if I have the cash when I get paid on Tues I will replace the M/C too.

Once I get some gas in the car I will fire her up and try plugging the line to the booster and see if it makes a difference in how the car runs, actually I just remembered I noticed that sometimes when braking the car would sputter slightly or start idling rougher, especially at a red light, then smooth out when I let go of the brakes so ive got a vacuum leak for sure, so I am looking forward to seeing how the car runs after this nevermind the brakes haha, because she runs alright as it is.

I will make some calls tomorrow to auto parts places and see what I can dig up, I'd like to get the parts locally if I can if only for the fact I'm finally motivated again to start tearing into this thing and I need to find something more positive and productive to spend my time on haha, the last 4-5 years have been spent pretty poorly and its time for me to start going DIY and get this bitch on the road and kicking ***.

MDchanic

That is not even close to being a crime, in any jurisdiction, anywhere in the US.

Are you sure you don't want to go talk to the INS and get your green card?
Weed's legal just a few mile south - You can roll up a huge spliff, grab your guns, and go out in the woods to shoot cans.


Don't imagine. Check it out. You don't have enough money to mess around guessing.


You just described the symptoms of a bad master cylinder.



Take a good look to rule out other leaks.

Everything you said above points to the master cylinder.



Now THAT is a symptom of a bad booster, but check it out before spending the money to replace it.
Nothing wrong with replacing the master first and see how it runs at that point, especially if the idle doesn't change when clamping the booster line.

- Eric

76olds

[QUOTE=MDchanic;680319]
Weed's legal just a few mile south - You can roll up a huge spliff, grab your guns, and go out in the woods to shoot cans.

LMAO... Be sure to buy a good pack of ZIG ZAGS you don't want to buy the cheap fast burning papers loose the heater... end up starting a forest fire and get charged with arson

CyberCholo

Haha yeah thats what I figured, but I'm not sure how the border works with that kind of thing, because up here in Canada it just got upgraded to a 3 year mandatory minimum federal time if they proceed with an indictable offense, but no minimum if they proceed summarily (the prosecutor or the crown as we call them can change their mind at any time so basically they can **** with you and hold that 3 years over your head) The stupid thing is the charge is "Possession of a restricted firearm with readily accessible ammunition" this a blanket charge that you get hit with from anything from having a handgun not locked up in your closet, to firing a handgun out in the bush (handguns at ranges only, only long-guns in the bush), to getting caught with a loaded handgun in your car. So whenever the police or anyone see the charge they assume I got caught with a loaded handgun on my person or in my vehicle as its the same charge either way and I have to explain the situation. I've been harassed by the police because of this and pulled over for literally no reason in bad neighborhoods "you were speeding but don't worry about it" uhh A I wasnt cause there was a cop behind me and B if it doesnt matter why did you pull m over? And now when I get stopped they call another 1-3 cars of backup to deal with me, and usually ask to search my car, fun. Of course this does nothing to stop the flow of illegal guns on the street. Tbh I would rather be in the states at this point, its only a matter of time until weed is legal and sane there but the gun laws in Canada will probably never be revamped even though theyve done nothing but cost us billions of dollars and increase crime, at least they killed the long gun registry.

Thank you so much for your help, I know the basics but not a whole lot, I will take a look tomorrow see if I can spot some leaks, and once I get gas in her and get her started (as long as the starter wants to co-operate another thing I need to replace) I'll plug that booster line and see what happens, I know a friend pointed out a leak from the booster like the 1st day I got the car but I never really saw it myself, I'll take a good look at it though, if I can get away with just replacing the MC cool, but if theres a vacuum leak in the booster I'd like to fix it and see how much better the car runs.

MDchanic

I don't smoke, myself - makes me fall asleep like a rock, and how much fun is that?

However, the above is, in my humble opinion, the essence of a free nation: Do whatever you want as long as you don't hurt anyone else.

- Eric

76olds

Twist up a small bat and pick up the three pack blue collar comedy video's and guaranteed you wont fall asleep, your side and jaws will be sore the next day from laughing so much. I read this somewhere in a magazine by the way !!

CyberCholo

I agree completely with you there, I don't do it too much myself tbh the stuff here is super strong and theres no way I can function at work or anything like that, in public is one thing but even then not too much, I usually do it at the end of the night or if I'm staying in, helps with my insomnia and other things.

Haha I would suggest Trailer Park Boys if you want your face to hurt the next day from laughing too much.

Anyways thanks a ton for the help guys, I'll report back ASAP.

76olds

If shared with your female partner it also makes for a great night under the sheets. She will love you forever !! That was in a different magazine I read lol !!!

CyberCholo

Called around today, quotes for the M/C were 55, 65, and 80, online for the right MC for drums and 350 I'm looking at 60ish after shipping, the cost of shipping one part doesn't make it worth it, money ended up being a bit tighter this cheque than I thought so I'm going to try and poke around for a cheap good used one in the meantime. Or is it possible or even worth it to rebuild my old one?

MDchanic

Master cylinder failure is due to failure of the ability to seal between the piston and cylinder.

Often the problem is deterioration of the rubber seals, and if this is the case, replacement of the seals and clearing debris from the tiny pinholes will fix the master.

Sometimes, though, due to poor maintenance and prolonged sitting, the bore of the master cylinder becomes pitted. In these cases, changing the seals won't help you.

- Eric

CyberCholo

Yeah and the rebuild kits I found online wont be much cheaper than the whole cylinder, so I might as well do the whole thing.

I was looking at shocks and it seems a lot easier than I thought, so Im going to swing by my grandmas and see if maybe my uncle wants to give me a hand with it, I'm sure I can do it but its always nice to have a second opinion handy, besides I need to borrow a set of jackstands.

CyberCholo

Took it for a quick boot around the block, yeah the MC is leaking baaaaaad from the seals under the cap, so its going next paycheque for sure.