jaunty75

I don't really have a question here, other than an interest in what other people's experiences are.

I am redoing the brakes on all four wheels on my '67 Delta 88, and I am amazed that Fusick can stay in business!!

I know they've been around for many years, and I know they have a reputation for selling high quality stuff and providing good customer service. I've bought many things from them myself over the years.

But when I put together the list of what I needed and then went through the Fusick catalog and came up with a total price, I was astonished when I compared it to what I can get locally and through other online vendors. Again, I realize that Fusick is selling top stuff, but they don't actually list brands in their catalog, so you really don't know what you're getting until you get it. You have to take their word for it that, as their catalog says, it's "the best quality merchandise available."

But here's what I'm talking about

Rear wheel cylinders (need two)
Fusick: $47.50 each
Car Parts Wholesale.com: $8.83 each

Front wheel cylinders (need two)
Fusick: $47.50 each
Car Parts Wholesale.com: $17.75 each

Left and right side adjuster screws:
Fusick: $18.50 each
my local AutoZone: $4.99 each

Front brake hose (need two):
Fusick: $33.50 each
my local AutoZone: $11.99 each

Front brake shoe set
Fusick: $55.00
my local AutoZone: $17.99

Rear brake shoe set
Fusick: $55.00
Car Parts Wholesale.com: $29.02


Total cost if all parts bought from Fusick: $404

Total cost if parts bought from other sources listed: $134


Now before anyone comes on here and tells me that the $8 and $17 wheel cylinders are crap and that the Fusick ones are gold plated, let me say that I realize that that's a possibility, but that I did order them, anyway, and I will take a close look at them because at that price difference, it's hard to justify spending 3 or 5 times as much at Fusick. Even the local Autozone guy, who could also get the wheel cylinders for me (but at $52 each, even more than Fusick) was surprised at how pricey they are and said he himself would look around before paying that much if he were working on his own car.

citcapp

I have found the same thing myself. My opinion is that they carry those parts for people who are looking for the correct factory numbered parts and for restoration not for the normal guy who is concerned about the driveability and safety only. I use Fusick for the hard to find parts like rubber items, mirrors, emblems and the like, not for easy to find auto mechanical parts.

Allan R

X2.
My car has a lot of factory correct parts on it, but it's still not what you'd call a show car or a trailer queen by any stretch of the imagination. I agree with both of you that in terms of functionality, if the same part is missing a factory number, that is minor to the overall aspect of function.

I shop around too. Up here in Canada we have AutoPartsWay.ca, Canadian Tire, NAPA, Partsource etc and they have saved me a bundle compared to dealer cost. Not only are their parts as functional as GM, they are fractions of the cost + on orders of C$75.00 they courier it free to my door via Fedex. 2-3 day service.

FYI, Year One, Fusicks, Tamraz, OPG, Supercars Unlimited, (and oh Brother-BAP) all seem to have a fair share of their parts imported from Taiwan. Same parts but with different markups. Gotta shop the market for what you want, and what you need. In most cases, it's not who you trust, it's what you can afford. I've said this b4: If I have a choice to buy a banana from Bob for 50 cents, why would I buy a banana from Stan for 2.00? (oooh, it's a DESIGNER banana. That means it must taste better?)

Nilsson

Fusicks wheel cylinders are not factory correct they are good (I forget the brand) made in France. You must have an old catalog because the rears are now $54.00. Do not buy the hold down pin kits you get 4-pins and keepers for $14.00. They show them in the catalog complete with the springs. I found out that is not correct. I complained that the pin kits I could get at Napa for $3.00 and $12.00 for the complete spring kit with pins. They made it good by sending me a spring kit for the rear, guess what it was Napa brand. Stay away from the cheap Chinese wheel cylinders sold at auto zone ect. Both mine started leaking after installation. So I went to Fusicks thinking I would get Delco, go to Napa or Rock auto. Rock auto has genuine Delco wheel cylinders if keeping your GM car all GM is important.

Fusicks prices are high enough that they should be supplying at least genuine GM parts where they can. The definition of resto is pretty weak with all the supposedly resto places.

Alb

Also you want to make sure that you get the right wheel cylinders. The rear cylinders on my cutlass came in 2 different sizes. 7/8 were $9.95 but the 13/16 were $43.50. Guess what I needed the 13/16 ones. I remember as a kid working for my uncle at his service station rebuilding them for around $6 a wheel. Boy how things have changed.

redoldsman

I think for parts like those mentioned above, you can do better than Fusick's. I know a lot of people on here have recommended RockAuto. I just did shocks and a brake job on my 94 Corvette last weekend and saved over $100 from RockAuto. I ordered the parts on Monday and they were here on Thursday. They seem to have several brands on most items like brake pads. I ordered Wagner pads all around and rotors for the rear. The pads were American made but the rotors came from, you guessed it, China. That is sad. I will continue to buy from Fusick's because they are the best Oldsmobile supplier out there.

jaunty75

I just now looked at the Rockauto website.

For the rear wheel cylinders on my car, they have a "Dorman" brand for $37.79, Raybestos for $39.79, and AC/Delco for $7.44. What gives on the price of the AC/Delco? Why would you ever buy the other two, especially since AC/Delco is a GM brand? Wouldn't that be most likely to be most correct for a GM car?


I can understand this thinking if you're talking about things that one can actually see. Who, even at a car show, pulls off brake drums to make sure the wheel cylinders are the correct brand???


This does concern me with the low-cost wheel cylinders I've ordered. However, I suspect that the Chinese-made items aren't as bad overall as they used to be what with China trying to make itself more of a real player on the world manufacturing stage, and I also think that, even if the package says some American brand on it, the item itself might still come from the far east. In other words, it may be getting more and more difficult to avoid getting things made in China. For many things, that might be the only place on the planet where the item is still being made at all.

Nilsson

AC/Delco wheel cylinders for my 68 are $47.75 from Rock Auto. I refuse to use Chinese parts when it comes to brakes and steering components. To many other manufactures out there still for these products. I will use a made in Mexico long before I use Chinese.

You may want to recheck that price.

jaunty75

OK, I do have to correct what I said above about Rockauto prices. The higher-priced Dorman and Raybestos wheel cylinders are for the FRONT wheels. The low-priced AC/Delco are for the REAR wheels. Rockauto does list rear wheel cylinders from Dorman and Raybestos for about the same price as the AC/Delcos ($5.17 for Dorman and $6.20 for Raybestos vs $7.44 for AC/Delco). These prices are NOTHING LIKE the $47.50 or $54 or whatever it is that Fusick charges for front and rear wheel cylinders.

Rockauto does not, apparently, offer AC/Delco wheel cylinders for the front wheels on my car. Their website shows only the low-priced rear ones.

jaunty75

I don't think so. I'm looking at the latest catalog the Fusick website has for the '61 to '75 full-size Oldsmobiles. The price is $47.50 for a wheel cylinder, front or rear, for 1961-67 88s and 98s. For 1968-70, the price is $53. Looking at the Cutlass catalog, every wheel cylinder they offer for every year of Cutlass is $53.00. If the prices are higher than this, they haven't posted them on their website.

Aron Nance

• In defense of Fusick's, you must consider that the majority of items that they sell are parts they have taken the time (read: money) to create molds/parts/etc from originals, and they usually are dead on in appearance. Brake shoes/cylinders/springs/etc are convenience items that they themselves must outsource, and they probably pay what you would pay at a quality parts house for them. As mentioned, they are a convenience for their customers, and they must mark up the price to stay in business. I still say they support the Oldsmobile Family much better than most of the others, and do sell only Olds parts. As to AZ and their "quality parts", that's an oxymoron, IMHO. Parts made in China are supposed to have some kind of tab on them with "Made in China" showing. Sad thing is, go to a HD, or Se--s, and pick up different things....often it will have that marking on them, at a higher price. Strongly suggest you stay with old, traditional parts houses (for hard parts) for the best prices/best product. I can safely say this, after my 32 years in that business. Just because it has a name brand box, doesn't mean the product inside IS. Oh, and by the way, heard today on the news that GM sold Hummer to a Chinese company!!!!!!!!! That plain scares the hell out of me.

jaunty75

I started out this thread by saying essentially that Fusick walks on water in the old Oldsmobile arena, so I have no quibble with what you say, and I have no doubt that the hobby would be much worse off without them. My point is, though, that when I'm sitting there with a price of $404 in one hand and a price of $134 in the other for the same stuff, Fusick's parts could be made in God's own factory, and I'm still gonna be thinkin' twice before I send them that much more money.


I think that this is a bit of an overstatement. I have bought many things from them over the years for a number of different cars, and I've never had a problem with any of their parts. Have you actually had something from them fail on you?

jaunty75

To add just a little bit more to this, I was just over at the NAPA website, and their prices on wheel cylinders, brake shoes, etc. are very much in line with the non-Fusick prices I quoted above. They want $8.69 for a rear wheel cylinder and $28.49 for the front wheels. A front brake hose is $11.49, which is even less than what Autozone charges. I don't think anyone would argue that NAPA, which has been around for many years, is selling "cheap Chinese junk" or words to that effect. Plus, NAPA will give you a 7% discount on all of these prices if you're an AAA member.

Again, my point is, it's hard to convince yourself to pay nearly $50 to Fusick for an $8.00 wheel cylinder.

Nilsson

If you order brake parts form the resto houses you will most likely get NAPA or Raybestos parts anyway, go with Napa you can't go wrong.


Obviously my rear wheel cylinders are different then yours. I could not find them anywhere cheaper then the $47.50 range unless they were off shore.

jaunty75

At NAPA, at least, it depends on your brake system. I don't know which you have on your '68 442.

If you select "front discs/rear drums," NAPA shows rear wheel cylinders for a '68 442 for $36.49. Front wheel cylinders for this car are $21.49.

If you select "four-wheel drum brakes," front wheel cylinders are the same at $21.49. Rear wheel cylinders do jump up to the price level you're finding, $55.49.

It's interesting that the front wheel cylinders are the SAME price, even though in one case it's disc brakes and in the other drums, while the rear cylinders are quite DIFFERENT in price, even though they're drum brakes in both cases.

Again, you can get 7% off of all these prices if you're an AAA member.

Nilsson

I need to join AAA.

joe_padavano

Um, what exactly are "front wheel cylinders" for a car with factory disk brakes. More to the point, a 1968 would have had the four piston calipers, which are not stocked by NAPA (and are about $300 apiece from specialty vendors).

jaunty75

Even if you aren't a member, you can still find them for well less than $50 in some cases.

jaunty75

I don't know. I'm just going by what the NAPA website shows if you plug in "1968 Oldsmobile 442 with Front Disks/Rear Drums." We don't question the Oracle. We merely bow to its wisdom!

Aron Nance

Obviously, YES, I have had something(s) fail from AZ, else why make such a statement. I also have great difficulity w/the majority of the conversation(s)/signage being in Spanish, as this is the U S of A, and we do speak English here! If that's political, so be it. Recently went in (late night/convenience/in a jam) with a friend to have his alternator checked (checked OK; I'm sure the equipment is fantastic, just question the individual who was doing the checking) and friend went on his merry way, a 1500 mile trip. Guess what? He had alternator/battery problems all the way. Turned out he had a bad alternator, replaced at a NAPA store. Worked fine, thereafter. So feel I do have some legitimancy in what I'm stating, along with the 32 years as a sales representative in the Automotive Aftermarket representing two major suppliers of same.

wmachine

Jaunty, I think you can make your point without wondering out loud how Fusick can stay in business and therby misleading others in the process. This has been discussed before on the forum and as Aron has pointed out, brake parts (and some of the other parts they carry) are not the strong suit of their business. And other vendors continue to come on to the scene and offer more things that chip away at what Fusick has carried for years when nobody else did. And for many *other* parts, Fusick still is *the* place to get them. Yes, I am quick to defend Fusick and for very good reason.
I know you don't mean to trash them, but if you step back and look at how you presented things you basically left the impression that Fusicks is simply overpriced.

My442

I bought an AC Delco air filter for my jeep, and it had a "Made in China" sticker on it.

So much for keeping your car all GM.......

Nilsson

I myself am looking foward to getting a Chinese Hummer.

jaunty75

This is not an example of what I was asking for. You (or your friend) did not suffer from the failure of a part purchased at Autozone. Rather, you ran into an Autozone staffer who, apparently, didn't know how to operate alternator test equipment. But even that's not certain because the apparently intermittent nature of the problem means that it could very well have tested OK at the Autozone and then failed later. The fact that an alternator purchased later at NAPA worked fine is not relevant. An alternator purchased at Autozone might have worked fine also.

I'll ask the question again. Do you have an example of a PART you purchased at Autozone that failed?

jaunty75

I'm sorry, and I know there's virtually nothing I post on here that you don't find fault with, but you are WAY out of line here.

I'm not misleading anybody. I'm stating FACTS. Stuff I read right off the website or right out of the catalog, and I have taken great pains to point out the positives that Fusick brings to this hobby. But that doesn't make them immune to commentary. The purpose of these forums is for people to relate experiences to each other regarding all aspects of the old Oldsmobile hobby, and brand names, both parts and vendors, get mentioned ALL the time.

jaunty75

An interesting point. You can't avoid "made in China" even if you wanted to!

jaunty75

I'll bet you don't have to wait! I'll wouldn't be surprised if the Hummer you buy TODAY has some Chinese-made parts in it. GM has lots of interests in China right now.

wmachine

I'm sorry you feel picked on. I really am and that's why I publicly saying so. I welcome your posts and encourage you to continue. But counterpoints come with the territory here.
You can think I'm way out of line here, and I can think you being too sensitive.
Facts can be quite misleading whether you think so or not. And when you interject facts with "I am amazed that Fusick can stay in business!!" (facts???), and don't acknowledge that that this is not representative of their whole business, I hardly consider that objective.
Obviously I'm not the only one who thought you didn't come across fairly. As I said, I know you didn't mean to, but I'll risk upsetting you to try to keep Fusick in proper light.
Nothing personal, my friend!

jaunty75

And so I can't engage in a little hyperbole once in a while, too? Hell, everyone does that on here all the time. And it's clearly an opinion, but at least it's based on facts. These forums are FULL of opinions, many unsubstantiated.

And where is your criticism of, for example, Aron Nance? He's impugning the integrity of Autozone parts without offering any actual evidence. Isn't THAT being misleading? You're strangely silent here. At least I'm pointing to some evidence.

I like how you selectively choose whom you pick on.

Oldsguy

All comments said and replied to, and those replies have been replied to. Let's let it end gracefully.

And remain friends.

On a similar thought. I purchased a fuel pump for my daily driver Buick LeSaber. Airtex is a major supplier found in many parts stores but a friend who works as a mechanic recommended that I return it for a name brand (It was the cheapest of three available). His experience has been Airtex items fail often and are not worth the initial savings. You can't argue with experience.

Aron Nance

Let's see:
House brand front brake pads for a '94 S10 - failed miserably within approximately 5K miles; replaced (limited lifetime warranty, has nothing to do w/time doing the repair; however, no different than anyone else's warranty). Failed again at approximatley 6K miles (squeaking/noisy/marginal brake action; worn out when changed). Same thing happened (both times) with their AZ branded front rotors. Replaced w/Wagner products, still working well w/no noise when sold (22K miles). Installer problems? Don't think so, as I had my shop owner/tech/friend that maintains all our vehicles do the work, for which he was compensated. Alternator replaced w/AZ product (at a different time), failed (99 miles), replaced, failed again (551 miles). Went to a different supplier, replaced, was still working when truck sold (after 22K miles). Hmmmmm. As mentioned, I know of what I speak. Sorry I didn't give specific example(s) before.

jaunty75

My $17.75 each, non-Fusick, non-AutoZone front wheel cylinders, and my $8.83 each, non-Fusick, non-Autozone rear wheel cylinders arrived yesterday. All seem hefty enough, and they match up with what's on the car. I plan to put the front ones on this weekend assuming I get a still-to-be-received package of additional parts which are supposed to arrive tomorrow. I had the drums turned this week. They look real nice, and the machine shop guy liked the fact that they were from such an old car. The rears will go on later, probably the following weekend.

I'm looking forward to the test drive after the installation, where I will be stomping on the brake pedal and hoping things don't explode.

Nilsson

Where did you end up buying your parts from?

jaunty75

I bought the wheel cylinders and the hold-down hardware kits from carpartswholesale.com

I don't have any previous experience with them, but their prices were good, and the turn-around time is fine. I ordered everything last Saturday, and the wheel cylinders were shipped from somewhere in New York state and arrived yesterday (Wednesday) via FedEx ground. The hardware kits are being shipped from California and are supposed to arrive tomorrow via UPS.

If you're looking for wheel cylinders but are a bit nervous about an unknown supplier, I later found, as I mentioned above, that the NAPA website has wheel cylinders, or at least has them for my car, at the same prices as carpartswholesale. Both were CONSIDERABLY less expensive that Fusick or Autozone.

If I do have one nasty little comment about carpartswholesale, they charged about $10 for the shipping, which was fine, but they also charged $8.00 for "handling." In the end, it was still a good price, so I went with them.

I bought the front brake shoes at Autozone (Duralast) as well as replacement adjusting screws and brake hoses. I haven't bought rear brake shoes yet because I haven't disassembled those brakes yet, and I like to have the old shoes in hand when ordering to measure them and make sure what I'm ordering or buying is as exact a match as I can determine.

My442

I use Rock Auto for all the replacement parts: brakes. hoses, suspension, etc.

And, I always buy known good brands: MOOG, Wagner, etc.

I go to the specialty Olds vendors when they are the only source.

citcapp

X2 this is my method as well

jaunty75

I mentioned Rock Auto above. For my car, their prices are similar to the others, at least for rear wheel cylinders. Around $5 or $6. Their front wheel cylinders are a little higher (high $30 range) than what you can get them from NAPA for (high $20s). The NAPA site doesn't mention the brand, but you can see "Made in USA" on them if you enlarge the photos.


I was just now looking around the Rock Auto site, and they've got front brake hoses for my car for $7.26 for "Dorman" brand and $8.90 for Raybestos. I paid $11.99 at Autozone and thought I got a good deal. Of course, I have to pay for shipping at Rock Auto and only sales tax at Autozone, and at Autozone I can walk out of the store with it instead of waiting for it to be shipped. But that $7.26 Rock Auto price compares to $33.50 for the same thing at Fusick.


Nobody has a cooler part look-up system on their site than Rock Auto.

gearheads78

I bought a carb kit 3 weeks ago from Auto Zone 18.00 it was not work using for toilet paper. I called Fusick and paid 54.00 it came in and was excellet quality and very complete. Sometimes you get what you pay for.


Look under adult services section on Craigslist (massage in call / out call) You will find what you are looking for

jaunty75

That's interesting. I don't mean to come across constantly as a defender of Autozone, but I bought the rebuild kit for my carburetor from Autozone, too, (back in June) and I paid about what you did. I remember it was less than $20.00. My kit was fine, though, with all the needed gaskets and other parts, and the thing went back together fine.

jaunty75

All of the hardware needed to complete the job on the front wheels arrived by Friday, so here are some before and after photos of the front brakes. I know this ain't the most exciting set of photos on the planet, but I figured I might as well finish the thought I started with this thread.



Left front wheel before before disassembling anything. Many years of grime, although the brake shoe linings still had some life in them. But I replaced them, anyway. The wheel cylinder itself had something hanging from it. It looked dowright haunted.






Left front wheel after the repair. All of the new springs were different colors. Green for the left hold-down spring, yellow for the right, blue for the return springs, and black for the adjusting screw spring at the bottom. The two springs associated with the actuator arm (lower right) did not have replacements in the hardware kit, so I had to reuse those. Actually, none of the original springs looked too terrible, and I could have reused them all if I had needed to.

You should see the springs that came with the rear wheel hardware kit. There's purple springs in there. I'll post pictures of that job when it gets done if for no other reason so that you can see the pretty colored springs. I'll probably do the rears next weekend.





Right front wheel before disassembly. It appears that the adjusting screw spring (at the bottom) was installed backwards by whoever last did a brake job on this car. The coiled end should be opposite of the star wheel. At least, that's the way it was on the left side, and that's the way it looks in the service manual photos. The coiled end would interfere with the rotation of the star wheel otherwise.

This is actually the second time I've come across something done wrong in a brake job by whoever did it previously. The brake shoes come in pairs for each side, but there are actually two different shoes for each side, with the lining on the shoe that is toward the front of the car shorter than the lining toward the rear of the car. When I re-did the front brakes on my '64 Jetstar, whoever did the job apparently didn't know this and put shoes of the same size on each side, not realizing that he was putting two short-lining shoes on one side and two long-lining shoes on the other. If you didn't know this about the shoes and didn't pay close attention to them, I could see how this mistake could be made. Anyway, when I found that problem with the brakes on that Jetstar, I laughed out loud because it explained why, when I stepped on the brakes, the car pulled to one side. It was pulling to the side with the two long-lining shoes.





Right front after the repair. Pretty, isn't it? As of this writing, I haven't actually reinstalled the drums, bled the brakes, or taken the car for a spin. That's tomorrow. I had to shut things down this afternoon about 3:30 so I could go upstairs and watch the Penn State game.





One conclusion I've drawn after re-doing the drum brakes on several old cars now is that, if there ever was a Rube-Goldberg contraption, the mechanism by which a drum brake stops a car certainly qualifies.