mini starter
September 12th, 2017, 08:11 AM
#1
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Location: Daphne, AL
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mini starter
67 442 with rally pac. No alt light. Does this need the diode wiring harness to install a mini starter?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Powermaster-....c100005.m1851
George
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Powermaster-....c100005.m1851
George
September 12th, 2017, 08:42 AM
#2
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If you are running an HEI, do you have voltage to the distributor BATT terminal when your key is in the start position? If you don't then you need that. In addition if you are still running points and need a bypass signal, then you need it. In both cases that wire is connected to the same terminal on the starter as the purple wire.
September 12th, 2017, 08:55 AM
#3
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September 12th, 2017, 08:56 AM
#4
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mini starter
Thanks Eric, I'm running a points distributor with a pertronix ignitor II conversion. I have 12V from a switched source off the fuse panel feeding the + side of flame thrower 2 coil. So I would assume this is just like having an HEI?
George
George
September 12th, 2017, 08:58 AM
#6
Old(s) Fart
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern VA
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Yes, if you ignition has a +12v feed that is independent of the starter bypass terminal and provides +12v in both START and RUN, you are good to go with no need for anything.
September 12th, 2017, 04:28 PM
#9
Old(s) Fart
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Location: Northern VA
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Look familiar?
$0.29 each at Jameco Electronics.
Oh, and this one is good for 1000 volts and 22 amps.
$0.29 each at Jameco Electronics.
Oh, and this one is good for 1000 volts and 22 amps.
November 7th, 2017, 09:56 PM
#12
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Location: Daphne, AL
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mini starter
Mini starter has purple wire on small terminal. It reads 9.1 volts in crank. Disconnected big battery wire from mini starter. Purple wire then read 12.7 volts in "crank". Assume the starter is placing a load on the purple wire causing the voltage drop. With only 9 volts at the purple wire terminal, in "crank", hooking the second wire, with blocking diode, will also read 9 volts, making the car hard to start. The ignition coil also has 12 volts coming from the main fuse panel that is powered when ignition is in "run".
Thought I would have 12 volts on purple wire at the starter, and I would attach a second wire with the blocking diode to that terminal also, and the other end of it up to the ignition coil. In "crank" I would have 12 volts to the ignition coil letting engine start. Then once I let off "crank" and to "run" the 12 volts I lost coming from an ign source on main fuse panel would return so the engine would continue to run.
Summary: I have a wire from the fuse panel labeled "IGN" that is 12 volts in "run", but loses power in "crank" and "off". In order to get 12 volts to the ignition coil in "crank" I attempted to run a wire, with a blocking diode, from the small terminal on the mini starter up to the same terminal on the ignition coil as the "ign" wire from the fuse panel. But only had 9 volts in "crank".
Since everything on the fuse panel loses power in "crank" with exception of the "Trans" fuse and the "Stoplight" fuse. I tapped 12 volts off the "Trans" fuse and ran it to the ignition coil. Now have 12 volts at ignition coil in "crank" and "run". Removed the wire from the mini starter, with the blocking diode, and the other end at the ignition coil. Seems to work OK but will attempt to start tomorrow when engine is cold and see if it is hard to start. Did I miss something?
George
Thought I would have 12 volts on purple wire at the starter, and I would attach a second wire with the blocking diode to that terminal also, and the other end of it up to the ignition coil. In "crank" I would have 12 volts to the ignition coil letting engine start. Then once I let off "crank" and to "run" the 12 volts I lost coming from an ign source on main fuse panel would return so the engine would continue to run.
Summary: I have a wire from the fuse panel labeled "IGN" that is 12 volts in "run", but loses power in "crank" and "off". In order to get 12 volts to the ignition coil in "crank" I attempted to run a wire, with a blocking diode, from the small terminal on the mini starter up to the same terminal on the ignition coil as the "ign" wire from the fuse panel. But only had 9 volts in "crank".
Since everything on the fuse panel loses power in "crank" with exception of the "Trans" fuse and the "Stoplight" fuse. I tapped 12 volts off the "Trans" fuse and ran it to the ignition coil. Now have 12 volts at ignition coil in "crank" and "run". Removed the wire from the mini starter, with the blocking diode, and the other end at the ignition coil. Seems to work OK but will attempt to start tomorrow when engine is cold and see if it is hard to start. Did I miss something?
George
November 8th, 2017, 04:45 AM
#13
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Location: Seneca Falls, NY
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I know this doesn't answer your question but I posted this in another thread and at Joe's recommendation this is what I did:
FWIW, I took it for a ride last weekend and it can take even more timing. I'll screw around with it next spring when I have some time to put the dial back timing light on it.
I have this Crane XRi points conversion kit and when I first installed it this past spring the car would start very hard. I ended up sending it back because I didn't think it was sending a fire signal to the coil and they sent a replacement. I hadn't gotten around to installing it but last weekend my starter went (actually it ended up not being my starter, but that another story), so I replaced my 40 year old starter with a Powermaster 9510. I had read a bunch of these threads and was pretty sure I was going to have to install the diode or a relay so I PM’d Joe P and he recommended this relay and harness (I'll get back to the XRi below):
https://www.amazon.com/HELLA-0077943.../dp/B003TEO9GU
https://www.amazon.com/HELLA-H847090.../dp/B000VU9D0C
It was an easy install. I mounted the relay on the firewall (I put it where my chassis ground is). I used my convertible top hot side post to feed 12V+ (30(3) wire). I connected both the existing yellow and the purple to the “S” post on the starter. I cut the yellow an inch or so from the + coil connection, connected the blue (85(2) wire) to the side coming from the starter (which powers up when the key is turned to start), connected the red (87(5) wire to the other side of the yellow wire at the + side of the coil. There is one red feed (87a(4) that isn’t used. Finally, the black 86(1) wire gets connected to ground.
I’m fairly sure the original XRi wasn’t getting 12V when I was starting and there wasn’t anything wrong with it. This one fires right up. I still can’t get the timing figured out because it seems like I need to run initial timing at about 15 degrees to get it to run properly but I think others have had this issue too. I haven’t checked to see what RPM my mechanical advance is all in at but with points I was all in at 25 degrees at 2200 RPM’s. Once the weather gets better I’ll take it for a ride and see how it runs and adjust the timing accordingly.
https://www.amazon.com/HELLA-0077943.../dp/B003TEO9GU
https://www.amazon.com/HELLA-H847090.../dp/B000VU9D0C
It was an easy install. I mounted the relay on the firewall (I put it where my chassis ground is). I used my convertible top hot side post to feed 12V+ (30(3) wire). I connected both the existing yellow and the purple to the “S” post on the starter. I cut the yellow an inch or so from the + coil connection, connected the blue (85(2) wire) to the side coming from the starter (which powers up when the key is turned to start), connected the red (87(5) wire to the other side of the yellow wire at the + side of the coil. There is one red feed (87a(4) that isn’t used. Finally, the black 86(1) wire gets connected to ground.
I’m fairly sure the original XRi wasn’t getting 12V when I was starting and there wasn’t anything wrong with it. This one fires right up. I still can’t get the timing figured out because it seems like I need to run initial timing at about 15 degrees to get it to run properly but I think others have had this issue too. I haven’t checked to see what RPM my mechanical advance is all in at but with points I was all in at 25 degrees at 2200 RPM’s. Once the weather gets better I’ll take it for a ride and see how it runs and adjust the timing accordingly.
Last edited by allyolds68; November 8th, 2017 at 04:53 AM.
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