Troys Toy 70

The Build basics

QF 850 BD carb MSD dist mechanical
Performer Intake center section cut 1" clear across.
Procomp heads from Mark
HS roller rockers
Lunati custom grind from Mark 231/238 571/565 @ 50 110 lsa Cam degreed at 106.
Racetec pistons from Mark. 10.22:1 468 ci
Scat Rods, N crank, studs
Melling HV pump stock oil pan.
Vr 1 20w - 50
91 Octane pump gas with a little 93 mixed in at the end.

This may may take me a while to get everything posted. I have two runs the best pull with stock W/Z manifolds, and no adjustments to motor switched to Flowtec Headers 1 3/4

Manifolds 450 Hpr/ 535 trq
Headers 480 Hpr/ 563 trq

Ill post the sheets as fast as I can. A couple of things you will notice is "at temp" should be a question, you'll see why. Melting pump needs purple spring.

BSFC is high. Distributor was never opened, and was fully in at 2500 rpm. I will need to check the bushings and springs, and possibly cut back on the Jets.

Glad to here your thoughts.

tru-blue 442

Subscribed Troy, sounds like a beast is born, congrats.

jensenracing77

Sounds great! Was this your first time to dyno an engine? My W-30 was my first and was a leaning experience. Did you get a video?

Troys Toy 70

Troys Toy 70

Troys Toy 70

Troys Toy 70

Before I forget, I want to thank Mark Remmel, it been a great experience and I learned a lot!

Troys Toy 70

Yes a first, it was really net! Very long day. Left at 8 in the morning got home at 9:30 last night. There is a problem with an oil leak on the back of the motor so it's back at the original machine shop. The one thing I will say is that take all your Olds notes with you, and don't assume. I did a good job, but a couple of things I could have done a little better.

Video in a few if the phone will cooperate.

wr1970

I have no thoughts.What is the ci of this engine?

Troys Toy 70

468 ci

Troys Toy 70

https://youtu.be/VYU5WzhuiBQ

Troys Toy 70

Not the best run of the bunch, but the best video of a pull I have. Ironically this was the 442 Hpr pull.

https://youtu.be/THPw4pvzDyc

Troys Toy 70

Edit: I should have said the at temp should "not" be a question.

So, I had Mark guide me, my machine shop do the work and another shop do the Dyno.

Dyno operator wants over 200 on the oil temp. That's where he feel optimal power resides. I cannot answer exactly why other than that. At any rate, she is still pulling well even with the heavier load.

I am happy with the motor, and love the sound. I could have listened to it all night long.😃😍

Troys Toy 70

Ok I may need a little help with the YouTube link. Doesn't look like it's working.

Troys Toy 70

One interesting note 30 increase on both the Hpr and trq with the cheapy headers. I always heard 15 to 20, but she definately like to breath on the exhaust a little more.

tru-blue 442

Let see if this works.

tru-blue 442

And the other one.

Troys Toy 70

Thanks Adam. Again your my hero for the day. Enjoy the status only 1/2 hour left.

It truely was a neat experience, particularly knowing it will be at least a year before I can push the fun pedal.

tru-blue 442

Ha ha, You're welcome Troy. She sounds Great!

Troys Toy 70

Thanks. I have literally waited 30 yrs to hear that sound from my 455. Man I am old.

oldsmobiledave

Who says a BBO can't make power with a Performer manifold? Still the most overlooked and underrated aftermarket intake for a BBO.

Congrats on the build and enjoy.

Troys Toy 70

Thanks Dave.

wr1970

Yeah that dyno sound is music.LOL Congrats on your build.

Troys Toy 70

Thanks Neeley A virtual Octacylindrus symphony.

83hurstguy

Congrats Troy, should be a street beast! I think you always end up with the "coulda, shoulda" after going on the dyno or to the track for testing. Sounds pretty nasty at idle too.

Troys Toy 70

Thanks Luke,

Here are the "non technical goals" as I presented to Mark.
A) above 425 hpr (really like above 450, ultimate 1:1 Hpr/ci) / 525 + torque.

B) Love a good rumble out the pipes, but must be able to be streetable power, pb and air car, th400.

C) If a new Camaro/Challenger/Mustang pulls up next to me, at least it gives them something to think about.😎

My feelings:
A) ✅
B) ✅
C) ✅

Mark was dead on here. Overall, I am a happy boy.

Cincinnati Rick

Very cool Troy. That thing sounds bad *** and has some impressive numbers. Good things come to those who wait right?

Troys Toy 70

Yea, I have to admit I play that idle video quite a bit. Still a lot of waiting to go, but it's progressing. My main focus is Gettysburg in 18.

Fun71

Yeah, that was the first thing I looked for. Thanks for posting both manifold and header configurations. I think that back to back comparison will settle a few bets that have been made over the years.

Troys Toy 70

Definately, more than expected.

Now if I had the right springs and bushings in the distributor to come in all in a little slower, and rejet the carb to bring down the Brake Specific number, it may have been a larger gap.

therobski

The sound is great! Makes my stock 67-400E in the 64 sound like the "Family Sedan!" Nice job putting your project together...

Troys Toy 70

Thanks! Here is one all dressed up and ready to go.

olds 307 and 403

Wow 30 HP and torque over the good BBO manifolds and cheap headers to boot. Wow that is a lot left with manifolds. I have seen the 20 HP and TQ for shorties and mid/high 20's in a SB Dodge magazine test. They started with truck/van manifolds, which suck, had a set, then hi po manifolds and a couple of headers. I was told it was all BS, I would say it was close.

EightballZ

i would love to see how much power the stock 1st gen toro manifolds are cutting.

good work troy, nice build. you have a choke on that carb?

Troys Toy 70

Thanks, yes it has an electric choke. The choke was wired open for the Dyno run.

Troys Toy 70

it was an opportune time to check. I had the headers with me, and the Dyno operator wasn't going to charge me any extra. So why not, and at least we will have a reference point.

We did three pulls while bringing the oil temps up. The last two were really close. The Dyno operator turned to me and ask jokingly if I switched motors on him. The Dyno operator, machine shop owner, and myself was surprised by the increase of 30, we all expected 15-20.

Now there are some flow characteristics here that may be different than a stock 455 that may have generated that large
of a gap. It would be interesting to compare a stock type rebuild with manifolds vs headers. That type of build may be closer to the 15-20 gain, but who knows. If someone does have a run like that I would like to see the comparison.

Funny thing is that the dyno and machine shop guys want to know what I am going to do now, as my original plan was to use the manifolds. 15-20 I had determined to not worry about. 30 opens up a whole new discussion.

GEARMAN69

Nice Job to all and love the side by side on the exhaust to show a real world parts comparison.

83hurstguy

With your aftermarket intake/carb/heads, and a roller cam that has a fair amount of overlap, the headers help a ton. Here's a 4 speed W30 engine that picked up 30 with headers... the 328 cam has a lot of overlap:

http://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/ubbt...lts#Post666626

You'll find the gain with headers isn't as much as cam overlap decreases. The 10-20 hp range is more likely. It's really a function of the whole combination more than individual parts.

Troys Toy 70

Cam overlap makes sense to me, but I am learning. Comparing the the 2, it doesn't seem that the rest of the aftermarket parts contributed to the difference.

I wondered when the machine shop had the 110 degreed at 106 how that helped/ hurt total performance. (They did that on their own. One of those things I wished I had aske about.) Still trying to get that straight. Since I am not racing every weekend, and am happy with the build it is more of an effort in understanding on my part.

EightballZ

afaik it helps to manage the idle and moves the torque curve towards low RPM range(??) if you advance the cam (in your case it has been retarded, right?)

i'm also still learning so dont take me for granted