1973olds98

My driver side bank of cylinders is burning oil...The only sparkplug with oil on it is the front one on the driverside...Me and my uncle took the vlave covers off and cleaned out the oil drain holes out..They were pretty clogged up....Since then a oil change happened..But the smoking is still there,,,I can start it up and let it idle all day long and it wont smoke..It only smokes basically when i come to a stop and take off..Or if i let off the throttle and coast to a stop it will start smoking while I am stopped..And then blow out a big puff when i take off and the the smoking stops while I am driving it...My uncle told me he thinks its the valve seals or guides....How much would a rebuild cost,,and would it be better to pull the engine and just get it over with with a rebuild kit...Other then smoking the 455 will light up the rear tires and has a strong pull....If i get just the heads done I was told by a few it will blow out the bottom end...

84 rocket

You could always use some umbrella seals its a pain on the engine but if your only burning oil in one cyl then try that, rebuilds can be costly but if you got the money then go for it

1973olds98

What are umbrella seals and how are they instaled..

scrappie

I had a set of 70 E heads done for 800.00. I was surprised at the cost but the heads are like new. Replace all exhaust valves.
I do not know what umbrella seals are but you could try changing the valve seals themselves. I know with Chebie motors it is a common solution to a common problem of smoking.

Olds64

Umbrella seals are just the valve seals. On Oldsmobiles they are made of a hard plastic material.

You can replace them with the engine and heads still on the car. You need a basic set of tools, a valve spring compressor, and about 5 feet of nylon rope.

You take all of the spark plugs out and feed the nylon rope into each cylinder one at a time. You ensure the valves in that cylinder are closed and rotate the engine slightly by hand until the nylon rope compresses and pushes against the valves. Then you use a valve spring compressor to remove the springs. Finally, you remove the valve guide seals and replace them. It isn't too hard to do, especially if you already have the valve covers off.

1973olds98

How much rope u put down into the cylinder

Olds64

Feed rope into the cylinder until you can't put anymore in. Then move the crank with a wrench slightly so the rope compresses against the valves. Make sure the rope is artificial. Nylon works best. Don't use hemp or sisal rope. It will shed fibers in the cylinder and this could cause scoring.

MX442

I just had a valve job and hardened exhaust seats installed. $325. Don't necessarily need the seats, but the machinist wouldn't guarantee his work, or let them out of the shop without them. Guess he needs extra money too...

scrappie

Come to think of it they do look like little umbrellas.

84 rocket

yeah im a chevy guy new to olds we call em umbrella seals we do chev and fords mostly at the shop but im building an olds now

1973olds98

A local machine shop gave me a price of 180.00-250.00 depending if it need new seats...I think I am going to go ahead and pull them..

mugzilla

$90 per sounds good...

I'm getting ready to go into mine so updates plz ...

1973olds98

I will keep my post updated,,i am going to try the nylon rope inside the cylinder that keeps covering the plug with oil and change the valve seals and see what happends...if it happends to fix it i will be totally happy and will go ahead and bolt my new headers on..

OLDS64

Do i bring the piston up or down before feeding in the rope?

1973olds98

OLDS64

how do i know when the valves are closed

84 rocket

Not to be rude but if you need to ask this its a good idea to get someone with the abilities to do the job! Its not that it is hard but to explain to someone over the net who maybe can or cant do it without messing something up is... my advise is get someone you know that turns wrenches and ask them sorry if it seams like a slam but engines can be tricky

64Rocket

I charge $250 for your basic valve job. It just goes up from there, such as new guides, hard seats, new valves, valve springs. Just how far do you want to go.
I use my air compressor to put air in the cyl to hold the valves shut.
You have to take the rocket arms off, that is how both valves are closed. Also you have to use a special valve spring compressor to remove the springs. Like "84 Rocket" said if you have to ask that question, you should not attempt. No slam intended, It is not something you can do in a few minutes. In order to get the valve covers off a few brackets have to be moved.
You should take a compression test first or a leak down check.

Gene

1973olds98

Thanks everyone who has actually offered help instead of slams...While my post may make me sound helpless I have been turning wrenches on cars for awhile but never have messed with the head assembly,,,


ps..I just got back from walmart with the rope and autozone with the seals...I see now removing the rocker arms would make the valves close...lol,,,,

Olds64

Once you feed the rope in you move the piston up slightly. Just enough to compress the rope against the valves to keep them in place.

1973olds98

thanks again

mugzilla

Here's my advice and it is also good for valve adjust ...

Loosen distributor cap. When the rotor points to the correct cylinder you can be assured that you are on TDC FOR THAT CYLINDER (or close enough)...

1973olds98

OK i got the cylinder done where there is always oil on the sparkplug...The seals were pretty dried up and brittle...Should i do them all or put it back together to see if that elimanates it from smoking..thanks for the rope trick...I was teling my uncle nd he thought i was crazy...but it worked fine..

Olds64

Replace all of the valve guide seals since you can't buy them individually.

MN71W30

I never heard the rope trick before. I welded an air hose fitting on to a spark plug base and fill the cylinder with 120 PSI. I've used it for 20 years and never dropped a valve yet.
Dave

hotrodpc

I've never heard the rope trick either, but I like the idea. I am used the 64 Rockets method and air, but on a semi worn to very worn engine, you can leak down alot of air quick. Not like that nylon rope is going to hurt anything being compressed up against the valves and a more solid hold in my opinion and not have to worry how worn the rings are and if its going to leak down.
My Opinion 1973, if you are there, feel energetic and confident, I'd do them all. You may have fixed this one, but if its brittle, likely the others are too and close behind that one. The seals are not that much, its the labor and time you want to invest is to be the deciding factor.

hotrodpc

Oh, and I do also agree with 64 on a valve job. Don't fall for that $90 quote crap. That is just for disassemble, hot tank, mag and clean up your seats and valve with a machine. Thats it. By the time you add hardened seats, valve guides and do not fall for the knurling short lived crap, just replace them preferably bronze if you budget allows, and a few valves your $90 valve job per head can easily double or close to triple. I also like to get a pressure test for cracks, not just a mag, and a triple angle job which cost a bit more too for the labor involved. I normally tell people you will spend about as much on your heads as you will your block. My 21 yo son in law told me he loves SBC, he is gonna rebuild one for $500 top to bottom. I told him no he isn't and explained machine work and head work and he is now putting the build on the back burner for income tax refund next April. At least he listened.

Olds64

Don't have valve seats cut unless the machinist does a three angle valve job. Anything else isn't worth it.

Warhead

$250 is the new $90.
You are a lucky mother tucker if you do not need anything else when you build the heads. 1 out of 100 are like this. REALLY GUYS.
With all of the oil this guy claims it is pumping, I think it needs more than a valve job. REALLY
Jim

1973olds98

warhead


Its not pumping tons of oil out the exhaust,,,,,lol,,,,And yes I beleive that is all i need..With the valve seals recently replaced the smoke is gone...So I hope I was lucky,,,

Olds64

C'mon guys. Stop with the cussing, I would have edited your posts if I had access to this forum. I already reported it to one of the other admins. No cussing please.

1973olds98

The machine shop where i will be needing work done is well know and was recommended by many local hot roders and...He really seems to love his job and isnt all about the $$$$$$$$$

1973olds98

i agree with the no cussing,,,,,,

hotrodpc

I think the $90 quote was for each head and the $250 Quote was for a set, so there is not as much difference there as appears.

JOHNNYOLDS442