duckblaster67

Since 442 was only an option this year on the Cutlass Supremes and not an actual model, is there anything on the tags that identify a TRUE 442 from a clone?

2blu442

Hello Duck
I'm not real up on the 1967 vintage, but if you don't find anything on the FAQ pages of this site try checking out: http://www.oldsmobility.com/ That site is specific to the 1967 Cutlass/442. John

wj67442

There is only one way to tell if its a true 442 because 442 was not its own model in 67 if you look at the cowl tag if the first 3 numbers are 338 that stands for a Cutlass V-8 ( the 8 in the number stands for 8 cylinder ) ( there were only 2 V-8"s made that year for the Cutlass 350 & 400 ) the 400 was the 442 engine..the next thing is check the engine right in front of the thermostat housing there will be a number if the number starts with 39 and ends with E that is a 400 engine after that you can check the numbers to the body to see if its a matching number car ...if the first 3 numbers are
333 / 334 / 335 or 336 then your car cannot be a 442

yogi442

I think if you check the only 2 V8's available in 67 for the Cutlass were the 330 and 400. The Cutlass was not optioned with 350 until 68. I could be wrong but seems I read this somewhere before.
Actually, now that I think about a friend of mine does have a stock 67 Cutlass and it has a 330 in it.

wj67442

dont know what i thinking about but yes you are right it is the 330 Thanks

oldsnut

Fremont Ca made 67 442s and they will not have the 5V on the cowl tag, only the Lansing cars had that. There are many things to look for, but the only true way to identify a 67 442 is to have the build sheet that matches the cars serial number. You can come close by just comparing the equipment and numbers but I have seen way too many 67 442s rusted away that were sold and the drivetrain, etc was swapped to a good Cutlass Supreme body.

duckblaster67

If the Fremont, CA 442s don't have the "5V" on the tag, what would they have then?

oldsnut

I made long winded reply to your question and it was lost for some reason so the long and short of it. Fremont cars have nothing that anyone has been able to identify as marking the W29 package. Without the build sheet you have nothing to use for identification. I have found that no matter where the 442s were built in 67 that the non-442 cars had a CS emblem on the C-pillar. Remove the inside dome light from the C-pillar and if you can see where the holes for the emblem were welded or puttied up you have a car that has been converted.

Black Beauty

My 67 442 has all of the right parts for a 442, however the number in front of the thermostat on my engine is 389 244 D. The first 3 do not match any of those you have listed and it doesn't end with an E. Any idea what model car this engine belonged in? I haven't been able to find out so far. Thanks.

GAOldsman

That would be a 425 cubic inch Olds engine from '66-'67 It would be designated as option L-75 for '67, however this was not availible for the '67 Cutlass/F-85 platform. The largest mill other than the 400 to be factory installed was a 455 in '70. And to my knowledge there were rumors of the 425 mill being used here and there during the mid '60's, but not documentation to prove it. The '68 and '69 H/O's had 455 but was not factory installed, to go around the Generals orders so to say on displacement/weight ratio.

Run to Rund

In 67 all 442s were based on the Cutlass, not the F85, so the VIN begins with 338077, 338177, or 338677 with the first 3 being Olds, the last 7 being for 1967. 3807 was the Sports Coupe (2 door sedan), 3817 was Holiday Coupe (2 door hardtop), and 3867 the convertible. The 5V on the Lansing 442 cowl tags was discussed above. Any other parts like the engine could have been swapped years ago. The original engine was a 400 (390925E next to the oil filler) and the rear lower control arms were boxed with a sway bar between them. The original 442 hood was louvered, a 442-only part.

wmachine

1967 442s made in Lansing *and* Framingham will have the column 5 "V" to denote 442 body trim. This is proof positive.
Otherwise, there *are* other ways besides a build sheet. In addition to original paperwork (window sticker, invoice, bill of sale, etc.), the Protect-O-Plate will verify a 442 because it will contain a 442-only engine unit number.

Where do you go to get all of this information?
Wild About Cars. http://wildaboutcars.com
You'll find Chassis Service Manuals, Product Information Manuals (AKA Assembly Manuals), Inspector's Manuals, and other documents that will contain this and much much more.

joe_padavano

Glad to see Kurt back, but you do all realize that this thread is 4.5 years old, right?

wmachine

Sure! But Wild About Cars isn't......

Ranzan

I wish I was 4.5 years old ..... Oh wait according to my wife I am

Black Beauty

Wow, I never thought I'd get such a great response on a thread as old as this one. The cowl tag has a couple of other things I'm having trouble with. I've attached the complete listing of the cowl tag.

So far I've deciphered everything except the trim code: 980-C and the paint code: L-2

Can anyone help with these? I think the paint code "L" means the lower body color was Tahoe Turquoise but what about the 2? Could that be for the vinyl top? Also, the trim code 980 seems to mean Holiday Coupe with black interior and bench seat but I can't find anything about the "C". Thanks for your help.

GAOldsman

980 = Black interior bench seat Cutlass Supreme platform
C = Provincial White Lower Exterior Color
L = Tropic Torquoise Upper (top) Exterior Color
My neighbor had this exact combo on his '67 no vinyl top though

Post a pic of the actual trim (cowl) tag, this will help on the rest.

wmachine

Um, no.

the C goes with the interior and means the Strato Bench Seat.

L2 is exterior, Tropic Turquoise bottom with a black vinyl top.

Black Beauty

Thanks, sorry about the delay in posting, it's been busy around here. I've been searching a couple of sites and pretty much decided that the L-2 is exactly as you say. I also ran across a line someplace that said the C meant chrome window moldings but that was just a guess. By the way, how's a "Strato" Bench Seat different than a regular bench seat? Just to be sure that I've correctly represented the cowl tag, here's a picture of it:

67post

Could be off here, but Kurt knows if this is correct. This is for C/S two doors and 442s only. The black Strato was coded 980C, regular bench coded 920A. The difference was in the fold down arm rest (Stratos). Only regular benches for post cars (33807), not hardtops like yours.

Bob

copper128

980 C is a black "custom sport front seat". StratoBench wasn't offered on the Cutlass in 67, only big cars. The custom sport front seat is a split bench with folding armrest. It was option code A65. A no cost option in place of the 442's standard Strato bucket seats
Here's my 67's trim tag:

67post

So what's a Strato?

Thanks,
Bob

Oldsmaniac

A strato as found in the larger cars is a bench with bucket seat backs.

copper128

Strato Bench looked just like 2 Strato buckets joined in the center of the lower and with a folding center armrest.

P1010039-1.jpg

copper128

P1010038.jpg

Black Beauty

My front seat is not a split bench even though it should be. I'm not surprised however, since a previous owner substituted a 425 for the 400 the seat was probably taken from the same Toronado and installed in this car. It doesn't sit quite right, too close to the steering wheel. Someone with big thighs wouldn't be able to get in the driver's seat. Here's a pic of the seat.... what do you think?

copper128

That is the correct custom sport bench for a 442 holiday coupe. Exactly the same as in my car. I agree it sits too high and doesn't go back far enough - and my car has the power adjuster option, too.

Black Beauty

Silly me! I thought a "split" bench seat meant that the seat part was split also. My wife's Lincoln is like that.

Chesrown 67 OAI

Man - yuse gots lotsa letters on that trim tag!! Ya know what they all mean? If not, our guru here Kurt (Wmachines) can tell ya all what each of those letters and numbers on each of the lines means!
Identifying a true factory 67 W 30 is an altogether different animal!!!

copper128

Yeah, there is a bunch of stuff on there ain't it?
Way back when I first got the car I had one of the guys on ROP ID some of it, but I've forgotten most of that info. I do have the original window sticker that lists 26 options totalling $1,583.20! Somebody really loaded this car up, but it's mostly luxury, not performance options. If anyone is really interested I'll post a pic of the sticker.
It was delivered on 1/14/67 at Bowen's Oldsmobile in Richmond, IN.

Chesrown 67 OAI

Its absolutely amazing how many 67s were sold in Indiana? 2 of mine were originally delivered to Indiana dealers and you see many for sale by Indiana owners today!
If I remember correctly, that 'J" in your 5VJ code denotes "center" back seat belt!! Is that listed as an option on your window sticker? One of mine has that center rear seat belt!

copper128

Yes, I have 2 seat belt options listed:
A39 Deluxe frt & rr seat belts $6.32
AL5 Rear center seat belt - deluxe $7.90

Chesrown 67 OAI

Could you post a pic of your whole window sticker Please?

Is your car bench seat w/armrest and 4 speed?
or buckets 4 speed and console?

67post

Thanks for the education and the pictures.

I'd like to see that "loaded" tag decoded too!

Bob

copper128

Bench seat w/column shift automatic. I currently have an aftermarket Hurst DualGate installed.

copper128

Sorry, it was pretty dirty in this photo taken during the resto a few years ago.

Chesrown 67 OAI

Thanx for the pic-
I was half-right --- i thought the 980-C meant black bench w/center foldown armrest.

Ill ask Kurt to post complete ID of your tag on here.
TV

Chesrown 67 OAI

Wowser!! Your window sticker price is $4458.00!! My original 67 W-30 only stickered out at $3507.00!
But then only options were 442 pkg, W30 pkg, AM radio, Power rear antenna!
That was it!!! Still cant understand why they ordered it with a radio? Unless they wanted the extra weight of the power antenna over the right rear wheel?
And they had to order a radio in order to get the Power rear antenna!! LOL!!!
Its the car in my avatar!

copper128

That is odd about the radio and power antenna. Why bother?

Question: Did the W30 option include Anti-Spin? I always thought it was a required option rather than part of the pkg. My non-W30 came with the standard 442 3.08 open rear.

Chesrown 67 OAI

I'm never sure of anything because someone seems to always call you out about it -- but that being said ---- I believe that the special Type P cone-style posi rear came with the W-30 package -- 3.90 gears with the Automatic --- other ratios were no-cost option on the order. My recollection was that was the "standard" rear in the W cars?
I really dont recall seeing "anti-slip" as a cost option on the sticker?
If I tried, I could come up with the cost options on all that i remeber on the car and see how close I could come to the 3507.00 sticker price.
I'm sure W-Machine Kurt or Curt A. would know the answer for certain??