JPMDaddy

Have a new to me 71 Cutlass, with what appears to be a 'corporate' replacement motor - light blue in color (poorly painted gold by PO)

drained oil and found a Pennzoil PZ-2 on it. Catalog at Autozone showed an AC PF454... got it home and it doesn't match up..

also, the filter mounting block seems to be held to block by 3 bolts and has a leaking gasket behind it....

Question is...(sorry so long winded) Might I have an 80-82 SBO? l see different filter and a 'oil filter gasket' for that application?

MDchanic

Numbers from the engine or photos might help just a little bit here.

- Eric

JPMDaddy

got it, thanks...

olds 307 and 403

You can interchange the tiny filter with larger filters. I would suggest the 51258 or 51049 Wix or Hastings LF222 filters.

MDchanic

I interpreted this as meaning that the filter wouldn't screw on, which led me to wonder whether this was even an Olds motor, which led me to ask for photos.



Also, the WIX 51258 is the same filter as the NAPA Gold 1258.

- Eric

M-14

They did down size the oil filters on the olds v8s starting in the 80s. If you've got the room (you should on a 71) you can use the larger one.

JPMDaddy

I appreciate the questions Eric, kinda a lost el camino guy here...

Casting number is 395558 2, and appears to have been blue somewhere along its lifetime. I just repainted the valve covers...fixing other leaks

DSC_3676_zps4b8476f1.jpg

Here is a pic of the offending oil leaker.... new gasket coming LOL

DSC_3679_zps8c41be92.jpg

Never thought the oil change would take this long - LIKE EVERYTHING..... 'snakebit' but I have to laugh...

MDchanic

Yeah that's a 350 up to '76. The oil filter base you pictured is the standard one for all Olds 260, 307, 330, 350, 425, and 455 engines (except for many Toros).
They often leak, but are easy to fix.

That NAPA 1258 / WIX 51258 is the way to go.

- Eric

rocketraider

You're a victim of a bad catalog cross-reference and a parts guy who believes all GM 350 cid engines are the same. The PF454 is a later Chevrolet V8 application- short and fat, and a lot of Chevy guys have trouble fitting it where it needs to go and dislike it for that reason. However, when you want to keep your GM car all GM and ACD consolidates a bunch of part numbers...

That's when the aftermarket comes to the rescue with properly fitting parts that are often better than the factory pieces. I'll admit, I'm not too keen on using newer production ACD filters. A WIX/NAPA Gold or a Purolator get the job done for me anymore. There are many other filters available that surpass OE quality.

JPMDaddy

on the right track now, got the WIX 51258 and the proper gasket for filter housing...

still kinda wonder why this motor was blue under the gold as the casting number seems to coincide with a 71, guess I still need to find the rest of the numbers on this block. Just curious as I start to clean up stuff and do some repainting....

Octania

Typically what is seen whan a 2-bbl motor is converted to 4-bbl with blue-engine era parts- EGR type intake, maybe blue rocker covers. Look around the bottom of the engine for gold paint. 350's thru 1976 or so should have been gold originally. Note the interesting routing of your carb's fuel line. Hand bent?

The heads should be "7" for 1971 or 7a for 1972 [teensy subscript upper case "A"]... and look for the engine unit number on the oil fill tube, it that starts with "1" then it's a 1971 engine [well, oil fill tube anyhow]. You can do the VIN stamp search if you really care if the block is original or where it came from. My new graphic:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1085196...01482929692770

"They often leak"
really? Out of 100's I have seen, exactly one leaked, and it leaked at the filter to base interface no matter what I did to it, so I broke it with a hammer to save anyone else the hassle and recycled it and put one of the dozens of alternates on. I have heard of folks using the incorrect Toro gasket on a non-toro adapter- which leads to MAJOR leakage... the shape of the center divider rib across the cavities should be a good guide, but sometimes folks do not pay attention.

You'll be running fine in no time.

joe_padavano

The casting number "coincides" with every Olds 350 built from the 1968 to the 1976 model year. They were corporate blue the last few years. Check the VIN derivative stamp, which will tell you exactly what model year it was built and whether or not it was born in that car.

Edit: After zooming in on the smallish photo, the EGR blockoff plate pegs the intake as a 1973-later intake. As Chris points out, this may be a conversion from 2bbl to 4bbl, or it may mean that you have a mid-1970s 350, which would also be consistent with the blue paint under the gold. Is the missing rear bracket on the alternator that straddles the valve cover your doing, or the P.O.'s "workmanship"?

Octania

I am still thinking the blue under gold vs gold under blue is hard to tell... and on which part?

Ck the Engine Unit Number and VIN stamp per above.

Joe, I think you misspelled "workmanshit"

"Crapsmanship" maybe?

:-)

JPMDaddy

The missing bracket was PO's doing, and the existing bracket was loose too.

drawing or pic of what I need to find for proper support?

Thanks Joe

Octania

Another thing to beware of with intake swaps is the fitting for the hose to the heater core. IF the AC vacuum operated valve is in place, it's probably OK. A hardware store pipe nipple IS NOT ok... If the AC valve is not in place then a factory type nipple with restriction should be used.

MDchanic

Well. I haven't seen hundreds, but of the ones I have seen, every one had a decent amount of oil caked around and over the filter adapter.

Not liquid-pouring-out-and-dripping-on-the floor leaks, but still they clearly ooze over time.

- Eric

coppercutlass

For refrence. The filters #'s that are common for olds at the local autozone are usually ph25 fram, s25 for the stp. Advance auto has never once had the right filer I always get the chevy one and when I tell them their part numbers are all messed up they get mad. I have used these filters on 307's and 350's. Im not a bbo guy so I couldn't speak for that app.Im currently running a napa filter as I found my old shop's acct. number in some paper work so im back to getting parts cheap lol. I'll have to crawl underneath to get that number off the filter if you want it . Also for the oil filter adapter there is a few different styles if im correct so have that housing in handy to make sure it matches up.

rocketraider

All displacements 59-90 Oldsmobile-design V8 engines can use the same filters, whether they are PF7, PF31, PF30, PF24, PF58, PF61 and on to infinity, plus whatever other manufacturers part numbers cross-reference to those.

I had the wagon in a Goodyear shop last summer for an oil change and I could not get it thru that "technician's" skull that a Chevrolet filter would not work on that engine. He kept saying this filter won't work. I said what did you get it for? "350". "Did you get one for a Chevrolet 350 or an Oldsmobile 350?" "All these cars have Chevy 350s in them!" Oh hell no they don't...

I took it there to save a little time and avoid fooling with used oil disposal. I could have changed the oil myself in half the time I waited there. Took them 2-1/2 hours to get that car in there and oil changed, and a good half-hour of that was me trying to tell them the right filter to use.

joe_padavano

Maybe...

joe_padavano

Yet another example of why I'm the only person who works on my vehicles.

JPMDaddy

Longest oil change ever in my book. got the right wix filter and the proper gasket to block.. cleaned all up and re-assembled it all, filled her up and............

LEAK from what appears to be from the oil filter housing assembly with the new gasket...

IS there a trick or gotcha or some other common problem I need to look for??

I'll be looking tomorrow, at least it has all been clean and the leak source should be visible and much cooler to touch...

MDchanic

There are, I believe, three different base gaskets, all of which would probably look the same at a glance.

You may have gotten the wrong one. Did you keep your old one and line it up with the new one to be sure?
If not, you can line it up on the base itself and make sure that it follows all of the internal lines.

If not that, there's no trick that I know of - just put a little sealant on there (anything oil-proof) and it should be good.

Since the base was leaking before, I'd have a good look at it for any damage to the sealing surfaces (easy to damage the aluminum base, hard to damage the cast iron block), and if you find any, you should have no problem getting a replacement base from a member here, as they are a dime a dozen.

- Eric

JPMDaddy

did searches on several model year olds 350's and the same gasket was shown for all at O'Reillys.... and it had enough unique features to match up - it seems to be right one.

There was basically nothing left of old gasket, literally .. although we didn't use RTV or other gasket sealer... the gasket seemed pretty stout and definitely had a block side and a housing side....

If this has to come apart again, I will probably try to replace the housing, are NOS or repro parts available? What is the right 'search term' for this part?

Thanks, john

MDchanic

I never heard of a NOS or repro one. Essentially, they don't wear out, and everybody's got a few in a box somewhere.

- Eric

JPMDaddy

thanks Eric, found some used ones on Ebay - if it turns out I need one....

coppercutlass

I have more than a few if you need one.

JPMDaddy

Thanks all, found the leak, wasn't the oil filter housing... valve cover gasket - even though it had been replaced...

good to go now, on a shake-down cruise

One of Many with a smile on my face

MDchanic

VC gaskets are the source of many leaks attributed to other sources.

Glad you found it!

- Eric

edzolz

Do you realize this thread is from 2013????