350

[78olds]

if iwas to put a 350 in my 78 olds , it has a 260 now. what would be the best engine to get. a brand new crate engine thats been beefed up a little or find one to rebuild . i plan on keeping my car forever so i want to do the best thing for it. and if i was to get a crate engine who would be the best to get it from. thanks in advance

[Eightupman]

Well there are a few things to consider...and everyone will have something to add to this...

I know of only a few respectable Olds engine builders that offer crate motors. IIRC, they are higher HP units. Mondello (not highly regarded on this site) is one of them. You will have a warranty on them as well.

http://www.cmengines.com offers a mild build longblock for $2500 and then there is the shipping issue.

http://www.proformanceunlimited.com is in Ocean NJ, close to you, however they want $6800 for a turn key motor. HOWEVER since they are up the road they may custom build you one... 1 year warranty unlimited miles...


A home built motor will allow you to have 100% control of what is in the engine. you could also do a little at a time as money prevailed. Take the heads out for work, then take the block out to be punched..then buy the kit, etc. You could commision your local engine builder to build it for and let him take the heat if it grenades under normal use...

Hope this helps a bit. And I still have a shortblock for you if you go that route!! (that was my quick sales pitch...LOL)

[texasred]

78,

I'm with Eightup. Go with a good Olds engine man. Just make sure they actually have experience with Olds...because this ain't a F*rd or Ch#vy. There's a lot of guys out there that will turn your "Rocket" into a "boat anchor".

Down here, you can get a good build for $1200-1500 (your mileage may vary). Find your nearest Oldsmobile club at www.oldsclub.org and contact them for builders in your area.

C.J.

[78olds]

1200 to 1500 is that with you bringing them a engine

[Eightupman]

Good question....I bet the production builders would work on the core charge system. They would give you one off the shelf (if they had one ready), and you brought (shipped) them the rebuildable core. If no core they would charge an additional amount to recoupe buying another to build.

Your local guy would need the motor before he got started.

John

[texasred]

That price is a local Olds man and you bring the motor. Again, that is a wag for amild build with name brand but not custom parts. Depending on the backlog, a builder should be able to get it all done in a couple of weeks. My best bud here in San Antonio (an Olds engine and QJet builder) will be signed on this board in a day or so (I finally talked him into checking it out) and he can give you a better idea.

C.J.

[texasred]

I was just talking with one of my fellow "Olds men" at the Autorama tonight...he said you can make a killer stroker motor out of the 260. I'll get more details in a couple of days (after the show). Sounded interesting.

C.J.

[78olds]

that would be awesome also would be differant let me know thanks C.J.

[texasred]

For your reading pleasure! This thing ends uo around 300 Cu. In.

Buick, having had given up the 215, recast the block as a cast iron version: the Buick 300. Slightly taller and larger bore, but the same bore to bore and bearing placement. This engine was equipped with a 3.4" stroke crank that had larger bearings and a different rear seal assembly. This makes the crank a 1/2 inch or inch longer out the back side and the flywheel bolt pattern different.

Buildups
Normally aspirated versions of the motor are still somewhat available, and there are a couple of shops which specialize in the motors (D&D in Michigan is the one that advertises in Hemmings every month). Parts are available to bump displacement out from the original 3.5 liters to 5.0.
The hot setup to use in this case is to swap the heads for those on a 1964 Buick 300, which is the same basic engine with a cast iron block and a displacement bump. The 300 heads are still aluminum, however, and will bolt to the 215 block. It is possible to drop the crank and heads from the 300 onto a 215 short block and get a 5.0 liter all aluminum V-8 that weighs about 310 lbs fully dressed.
Another interesting bit of trivia is that the 1964 Buick 300 is actually a cast iron version of this motor with aluminum heads - in fact these 1964 heads have larger ports and valves and will bolt to a 215.
Many articles have been written on installing this crank into the 215 case to get the 215's light package with the increased stroke and displacement of the 300's crank. It does, however, require engine rear seal machining, crank grinding, and some funny business to get a manual tranny to bolt up.

Olds 215
In Britian, some 215s have been bored and stroked to an amazing 4.5 to 5.0 liters through the use of the factory crank from a diesel Rover (known as the Tundra something or other). Now then, does this not sound fun to you, an Olds F-85, with the aluminum Rover 3.5 liter block, bored to 3.8 liters, stroked from 2.8" to 3.5" using a Mickey Thompson crank, Big aluminum head via Buick 300 etc. Volvo oversize valves, a 3.8 liter front case w/HEI ignition and still able to hang a serpentine belt with all accessories on it, and bolted up to a Borg/Warner 5 speed tranny?

Aftermarket
The 215 CID is alive and well with its own support structure. D&D Performance in Romulus, MI sells kits and engine parts. Anybody who is interested in 215's should contact Dan LaGrou for parts. D&D sells adapters to mate later Hydramatic transmisions to the 215, if you rework the floor to make room for the larger cases.
D&D FABRICATIONS
810-798-2491
8005 Tiffany
Almont, MI 48003
There's also a guy in Utah who sells kits to swap the motor into early RX-7s. There is a lot of early 60s parts for these motors out at the swap meets, like Weber manifolds, valve covers, etc.
There are 2 books available on the Rover (and therefore the Buick and Oldsmobile 215 V-8's), The Rover V-8 Engine and Tuning Rover V-8 Engines (tuning is the British word for buildup). Both are available from:
Haynes Publications Inc.
861 Lawrence Drive
Newbury Park, CA 91320
The 215 weighs only 20 lbs more than the Vega 4 cylinder, so the car still goes around corners (try that with your small block Chevy). The 215 is an awsome engine for its size and weight. A full-up 4bbl version weighs only 305 lbs wet. Parts are available, as described above, to bore and stroke it to 5.0 liters!
The main problem is that the 215 uses a unique transmission bolt pattern, which is unlike than on any other GM engine. Assuming that your car has an automatic, any engine swap will require a matching transmission as well. This is not the case with the 4-spd, where you will only require the correct bellhousing.

[78olds]

thanks

[z11375ss]

Keep it simple. Build a 350. Have it built for you so no screwups. Drop it in and go. No offense on the stroker route I just don't like messing w/ the stock dimensions of motors. I had a total of one stroker motor so maybe I can't speak. But that thing sucked a valve and cracked the block. Oh yeah, and cubic inches is the way to go. If you can do a 455 do it!