Why tolerate the madness?

Olds64 · 02-16-2008, 02:32 PM

I received a PM from another member about Norm's rude behavior and I began to wonder why Norm is still posting on our website... The other member told me that he would no longer post on our site because of Norm.

I would like Norm's posting privleges removed. I know he could just sign on as a different person in a day or two, but apparently I am not the only one that is fed up with his madness.

I finally put Norm on my "ignore list." I would encourage everyone else to do the same.

Thanks

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 05:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

........ I would like Norm's posting privleges removed ........

I suggest you post your sentiments in a PM to the Mods and/or administrators.

Or, you could be a man, and send send that PM to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

........ I know he could just sign on as a different person in a day or two ........

And be myself? I don't think so.

Norm

Modern Motoring · 02-17-2008, 07:33 AM

What's wrong with Norm ? So some people take him as "crusty" Big deal.. I enjoy reading everyone's postings on this forum, UNLESS YOU HAVE POOR SPELLING AND GRAMMAR ! Other than that, if I don't like someone's posting or a follow up reply, I move on. Simple really.

boese1978 · 02-17-2008, 07:42 AM

In my short time here I have read Norms posts and found him to be rude, condescending, arrogant and just a plain old jerk. In honor of your request to " be a man and send right to you" here you go- buzz off jerk, no one appreciates someone that has to hide behind a facade such as you do. People that post should " be themsleves".....if you have trouble with any of the verbiage I have used here get a dictionary, you know, from a book store, should be near the self help section.

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boese1978

........ In honor of your request to " be a man and send right to you" ........

Read it again. This time, read what is actually there:

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

........ Or, you could be a man, and send send that PM to me ........

My PM box is still empty. Looks like you have a problem with your reading comprehension?

Quote:

Originally Posted by boese1978

........ People that post should " be themsleves" ........

Yes they should. What is your point?

Quote:

Originally Posted by boese1978

........ if you have trouble with any of the verbiage I have used ........

If you have any trouble spelling THEMSELVES, get a dictionary, you know, from a book store, should be near the self help section.

Norm

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Modern Motoring

........ if I don't like someone's posting or a follow up reply, I move on ........

Works for me.

Norm

joe_padavano · 02-17-2008, 11:20 AM

I personally thank Norm for posting. He's got a lot of good info and we can all learn from him. I sense that Norm doesn't suffer fools, and frankly I can be the same way sometimes. People post asking about cams, torque converters, or other items, usually based on something someone said concerning a Chevy configuration, then 1) don't provide enough information for someone to offer an informed answer and 2) don't follow up with this information when requested. We're here to help each other, but that should start with helping oneself.

I'm of a certain age and disposition (some will say "curmudgeon") where I too prefer reading posts in English (as opposed to "TXT") with actual sentences and punctuation. I also get a little peeved when someone asks for free copies of service manual info or wiring diagrams. Heck, I paid for the book, and you can too.

The bottom line is get a thicker skin. Frankly, I rarely disagree with the things Norm says. I may have been a wee bit more tactful, but I usually agree. If you don't like it, use the delete button.

chip_gikey · 02-17-2008, 11:42 AM

Hmmm what happens with this thread will be interesting.

rocketraider · 02-17-2008, 03:48 PM

I can guarantee you Norm isn't hiding behind any facade- what you see and hear is the genuine article.

Norm, Joe P and I are all cut from the same cloth. We can be blunt or even bristly sometimes, especially when someone is being a total idiot or is obviously showing he hasn't done the slightest bit of research on his own. We've heard all the misinformation that's been spread about Olds thru the years. We also have enough experience and enough contacts with people who were there that if we don't have the answer, we can get it with a couple emails or phone calls.

I vote Norm stays. Grumpy ol' B or not, he knows as much about an Oldsmobile as anyone you will ever meet.

Besides, as much as the PC weenies would love it, the very nature of man does not guarantee you will go thru life and never be offended.

It's like an old boss told me once- "Sometimes you have to piss people off to get anything accomplished."

He was also known to say that sometimes you had to show your ass to get your point across.

I loved working with him, but when the Church of the Professionally Offended took over Corporate America, he decided he was financially able to retire and did.

Dapapadon · 02-17-2008, 05:47 PM

I'd also say Norm's knowledge is an asset to the site. Probably in the top three overall Oldsmobile knowledge on this site. And top two when it comes to Oldsmobile engines. Why would we want to lose someone with that kind of knowledge? I wouldn't.

Don

2blu442 · 02-17-2008, 06:42 PM

OK, when it comes to Political Correctness I know all about that as I work for the government. Yeah, some days I just want to puke over what we must do to not offend some special interest group. On the other hand, when I'm in the grocery store and some little kid points at a very large lady and states in a loud voice "WOW, SHE IS REALLY FAT!" I feel kinda bad for the large lady! Everyone is grumpy once in a while, and for some crusty old gear heads it happens more often than once in a while. But would it be too terribly hard for the crusty old guy to try and tone it down a little? The newbie that has no clue we all would rather walk then put a Che*y in our Oldsmobiles doesn't need us to bite his head off. If we do that he may never see the light, and experience the satisfaction of driving a real car. If it wasn't for a crusty old geezer with a wornout set of tools being very patient with a 17 year old kid I would never have learned what a satisfying hobby this can be. Isn't the purpose of this site to share our knowledge and experiece to help others learn about and enjoy these cars? John

dar83501 · 02-17-2008, 08:33 PM

I don't really mind Norm, he does seem pretty knowledgeable, however it wouldn't kill him not to butcher somebody in every single post. Everyone has their flaws I suppose. It doesn't bother me too much, because people aren't really capable of becoming argumentative or trying to systematically counter & destroy things I say, because I don't comment on things I don't know about...I'm sure others don't feel the same way though.

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 09:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dar83501

........ not to butcher somebody in every single post ........

Every single post?

Quote:

Originally Posted by dar83501

........ because I don't comment on things I don't know about ........

Good thinking. I think everyone should do the same.

Norm

jeffrey · 02-17-2008, 09:55 PM

After thinking about this thread all day, Here's my 2 cents,

#1 I joined this site to learn more about antique Oldsmobiles.

#2 I joined this site to meet other people who want to learn more about antique Oldsmobiles.

#3 I joined this site to learn things from people who KNOW antique Oldsmobiles.

That being said, let me say this,

While Norm can be (and is) confrontational at times, does anybody here know more about antique Oldsmobiles than he does?

I'm not saying that wisdom or experience gives one free reign to become a donkeyhole, it doesnt', but there is a level of respect that should be given to those who really KNOW these cars.

Everyone on the site is watching this thread, why dont we show some class, and TRY TO GET ALONG!

Jeff+10

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2blu442

........would it be too terribly hard for the crusty old guy to try and tone it down a little? ........

Tone?

My "tone" is set by the post I am replying to. Nothing more, nothing less.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2blu442

........ very patient with a 17 year old kid I would never have learned ........

Do you think your "eagerness/willingness to learn" had anything to do with it?

Norm

88 coupe · 02-17-2008, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeffrey

........ but there is a level of respect that should be given ........

The definition of "respect" seems to have changed, radically, during the past few years.

Norm

jeffrey · 02-17-2008, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

The definition of "respect" seems to have changed, radically, during the past few years.

Norm

Sadly, you're correct again.....

(previous post edited for clarification)

shaks 442 clone · 02-18-2008, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2blu442

OK, when it comes to Political Correctness I know all about that as I work for the government. Yeah, some days I just want to puke over what we must do to not offend some special interest group. On the other hand, when I'm in the grocery store and some little kid points at a very large lady and states in a loud voice "WOW, SHE IS REALLY FAT!" I feel kinda bad for the large lady! Everyone is grumpy once in a while, and for some crusty old gear heads it happens more often than once in a while. But would it be too terribly hard for the crusty old guy to try and tone it down a little? The newbie that has no clue we all would rather walk then put a Che*y in our Oldsmobiles doesn't need us to bite his head off. If we do that he may never see the light, and experience the satisfaction of driving a real car. If it wasn't for a crusty old geezer with a wornout set of tools being very patient with a 17 year old kid I would never have learned what a satisfying hobby this can be. Isn't the purpose of this site to share our knowledge and experiece to help others learn about and enjoy these cars? John

wow this really hit home with me haha, and what is even more unusal is the mechanic i apprentice for his name is john too.

and norms a cool guy in my opinion, he's always straight forward when he answers my questions.

Oldsguy · 02-18-2008, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chip_gikey

Hmmm what happens with this thread will be interesting.

Yes it will.

Oldsmaniac · 02-18-2008, 07:15 AM

If this thread is Norm vote I say he's in!....Very knowledgeable in my opinion. I dont feel that sentences need to be pulled out of posts and replys and commented on individually but thats my opinion and if its a way of getting to the point well thats fine too. Sometimes when I post I wonder if I will be "Normed"....Its almost like a scene out of "The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown" where Linus is waiting in the pumpkin patch for the Great Pumpkin. He makes a slip of the tongue and says "if the Great Pumpkin appears" instead of "when the Great Pumpkin appears"....Then he realizes he's doomed!...I get the same feeling sometimes here with posting!

88 coupe · 02-18-2008, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oldsmaniac

........ I dont feel that sentences need to be pulled out of posts and replys and commented on individually ........

It's done for the same reason that it was before Algore invented the Internet. Brevity and clarity. Should a complete post (regardless of its length) be quoted, if the comment refers to only one sentence? A waste of time and bandwidth.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oldsmaniac

........ if its a way of getting to the point ........

That too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oldsmaniac

........ Sometimes when I post I wonder if I will be "Normed" ........

Not likely, as you are one of those, whose posts are factual in nature.

I am confident, however, that if I did question anything you posted, You would not read anything into it, that I did not write. Instead, like anyone else who actually knows something about the subject, you would simply explain/defend your position. After a mature discussion, we might even agree to disagree.

At the other end of the spectrum: There are those who respond, to simple questions/comments, with personal attacks/insults. Does anyone think those "personal attacks/insults" are based on a knowledge of the topic?

Or, could it be possible, they are a ruse to divert attention from the BS that was questioned?

Norm

Wasted · 02-22-2008, 02:59 AM

I don't have a problem with Norm he helped me on here before when no one even tried to help. Yeah hes a little straight forward, but at least he helps people or tries to help all the time.

marcar1993 · 02-22-2008, 06:42 PM

I have been "normed" and find him rather confrentational, yet he didn't bother me any. He is a no-BS kinda guy. He knows his stuff and isn't afraid to call someone out on their mistakes. I respect norm, as he isn't trying to be condesending, it is just his "way". You don't like it to bad for you. My woodshop teacher was like norm is, but he knew his stuff and I really miss him, he was a nice guy, just don't make a mistake and attempt to argue that you're right. You probably aren't, seriously. That simple.

This from a 14 year old kid. Guys, grow up and grow some thicker skin!

rocketraider · 02-22-2008, 07:07 PM

Quote:

This from a 14 year old kid.

Who, had he not outed himself, would never have been suspected of such.

02-16-2008, 02:32 PM	#1 (permalink)
Olds64 Landyacht Club President Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 1,818	Why tolerate the madness? I received a PM from another member about Norm's rude behavior and I began to wonder why Norm is still posting on our website... The other member told me that he would no longer post on our site because of Norm. I would like Norm's posting privleges removed. I know he could just sign on as a different person in a day or two, but apparently I am not the only one that is fed up with his madness. I finally put Norm on my "ignore list." I would encourage everyone else to do the same. Thanks __________________ "Some men are Baptists, others Catholics. My father was an OLDSMOBILE man." Ralphie Billingsley A Christmas Story 1983 "We rei-eign, supreme, ooooh god! Burrito supreme, and a chicken supreme, and a CUTLASS SUPREME!" Tenacious D 2007

02-17-2008, 11:20 AM	#7 (permalink)
joe_padavano Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Northern VA Posts: 1,882	I personally thank Norm for posting. He's got a lot of good info and we can all learn from him. I sense that Norm doesn't suffer fools, and frankly I can be the same way sometimes. People post asking about cams, torque converters, or other items, usually based on something someone said concerning a Chevy configuration, then 1) don't provide enough information for someone to offer an informed answer and 2) don't follow up with this information when requested. We're here to help each other, but that should start with helping oneself. I'm of a certain age and disposition (some will say "curmudgeon") where I too prefer reading posts in English (as opposed to "TXT") with actual sentences and punctuation. I also get a little peeved when someone asks for free copies of service manual info or wiring diagrams. Heck, I paid for the book, and you can too. The bottom line is get a thicker skin. Frankly, I rarely disagree with the things Norm says. I may have been a wee bit more tactful, but I usually agree. If you don't like it, use the delete button. __________________ Joe Padavano 64 Jetstar 88 Conv 66 442 L-69 Conv 68 W-30 69 H/O 69 442 70 W-30 72 442 84 Custom Cruiser 86 Caprice wagon (w/307 Olds)

02-17-2008, 03:48 PM	#9 (permalink)
rocketraider Oldsdruid Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Danville Vajenya, the Last Capital of Dixie Posts: 405	I can guarantee you Norm isn't hiding behind any facade- what you see and hear is the genuine article. Norm, Joe P and I are all cut from the same cloth. We can be blunt or even bristly sometimes, especially when someone is being a total idiot or is obviously showing he hasn't done the slightest bit of research on his own. We've heard all the misinformation that's been spread about Olds thru the years. We also have enough experience and enough contacts with people who were there that if we don't have the answer, we can get it with a couple emails or phone calls. I vote Norm stays. Grumpy ol' B or not, he knows as much about an Oldsmobile as anyone you will ever meet. Besides, as much as the PC weenies would love it, the very nature of man does not guarantee you will go thru life and never be offended. It's like an old boss told me once- "Sometimes you have to piss people off to get anything accomplished." He was also known to say that sometimes you had to show your ass to get your point across. I loved working with him, but when the Church of the Professionally Offended took over Corporate America, he decided he was financially able to retire and did. __________________ I know absolutely nothing about Oldsmobiles. Just ask the owner of Oldspower.com Last edited by rocketraider : 02-17-2008 at 03:51 PM.

02-17-2008, 06:42 PM	#11 (permalink)
2blu442 Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Medford, Oregon Posts: 935	OK, when it comes to Political Correctness I know all about that as I work for the government. Yeah, some days I just want to puke over what we must do to not offend some special interest group. On the other hand, when I'm in the grocery store and some little kid points at a very large lady and states in a loud voice "WOW, SHE IS REALLY FAT!" I feel kinda bad for the large lady! Everyone is grumpy once in a while, and for some crusty old gear heads it happens more often than once in a while. But would it be too terribly hard for the crusty old guy to try and tone it down a little? The newbie that has no clue we all would rather walk then put a Chey in our Oldsmobiles doesn't need us to bite his head off. If we do that he may never see the light, and experience the satisfaction of driving a real car. If it wasn't for a crusty old geezer with a wornout set of tools being very patient with a 17 year old kid I would never have learned what a satisfying hobby this can be. Isn't the purpose of this site to share our knowledge and experiece to help others learn about and enjoy these cars? John __________________ 1964 Cutlass Factory 4spd 1965 442 4spd 1967 442 Auto 1967 Cutlass Convertible 1968 442 Auto 1969 442 W30 Auto 1970 442 4spd 1971 Cutlass Flat Top Wagon 1973 Chevy 3/4 Ton 454/TH400 Tow Vehicle Only the tow vehicle is finished!

02-17-2008, 08:33 PM	#12 (permalink)
dar83501 Brewsmobile > Bluesmobile Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Lewiston, Idaho Posts: 273	I don't really mind Norm, he does seem pretty knowledgeable, however it wouldn't kill him not to butcher somebody in every single post. Everyone has their flaws I suppose. It doesn't bother me too much, because people aren't really capable of becoming argumentative or trying to systematically counter & destroy things I say, because I don't comment on things I don't know about...I'm sure others don't feel the same way though. __________________ 1987 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme 455 Big Block Project - "The Brewsmobile"

02-17-2008, 07:33 AM	#3 (permalink)
Modern Motoring Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Sacramento Posts: 138	What's wrong with Norm ? So some people take him as "crusty" Big deal.. I enjoy reading everyone's postings on this forum, UNLESS YOU HAVE POOR SPELLING AND GRAMMAR ! Other than that, if I don't like someone's posting or a follow up reply, I move on. Simple really.

02-17-2008, 07:42 AM	#4 (permalink)
boese1978 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 20	In my short time here I have read Norms posts and found him to be rude, condescending, arrogant and just a plain old jerk. In honor of your request to " be a man and send right to you" here you go- buzz off jerk, no one appreciates someone that has to hide behind a facade such as you do. People that post should " be themsleves".....if you have trouble with any of the verbiage I have used here get a dictionary, you know, from a book store, should be near the self help section.

02-17-2008, 11:42 AM	#8 (permalink)
chip_gikey Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 43	Hmmm what happens with this thread will be interesting.

02-17-2008, 05:47 PM	#10 (permalink)
Dapapadon Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 316	I'd also say Norm's knowledge is an asset to the site. Probably in the top three overall Oldsmobile knowledge on this site. And top two when it comes to Oldsmobile engines. Why would we want to lose someone with that kind of knowledge? I wouldn't. Don

02-17-2008, 09:55 PM	#14 (permalink)
jeffrey Rocketeer Jr. Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 127	After thinking about this thread all day, Here's my 2 cents, #1 I joined this site to learn more about antique Oldsmobiles. #2 I joined this site to meet other people who want to learn more about antique Oldsmobiles. #3 I joined this site to learn things from people who KNOW antique Oldsmobiles. That being said, let me say this, While Norm can be (and is) confrontational at times, does anybody here know more about antique Oldsmobiles than he does? I'm not saying that wisdom or experience gives one free reign to become a donkeyhole, it doesnt', but there is a level of respect that should be given to those who really KNOW these cars. Everyone on the site is watching this thread, why dont we show some class, and TRY TO GET ALONG! Jeff+10 __________________ '53 Olds 88 '55 98 '56 Holiday 88 '56 S-88 Conv '70 Cutlass SX Last edited by jeffrey : 02-17-2008 at 11:02 PM.

02-18-2008, 07:15 AM	#20 (permalink)
Oldsmaniac Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: NJ Posts: 432	If this thread is Norm vote I say he's in!....Very knowledgeable in my opinion. I dont feel that sentences need to be pulled out of posts and replys and commented on individually but thats my opinion and if its a way of getting to the point well thats fine too. Sometimes when I post I wonder if I will be "Normed"....Its almost like a scene out of "The Great Pumpkin Charlie Brown" where Linus is waiting in the pumpkin patch for the Great Pumpkin. He makes a slip of the tongue and says "if the Great Pumpkin appears" instead of "when the Great Pumpkin appears"....Then he realizes he's doomed!...I get the same feeling sometimes here with posting! __________________ OCA Member 2587 '59 98 conv. '66 Starfire '66 Delta Fact.4spd '66 Delta conv. times 2 '67 442 conv. '68 Cutlass conv. '70 Rallye 350 '92 Custom Cruiser

02-22-2008, 02:59 AM	#22 (permalink)
Wasted Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 47	I don't have a problem with Norm he helped me on here before when no one even tried to help. Yeah hes a little straight forward, but at least he helps people or tries to help all the time.

02-22-2008, 06:42 PM	#23 (permalink)
marcar1993 Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 136	I have been "normed" and find him rather confrentational, yet he didn't bother me any. He is a no-BS kinda guy. He knows his stuff and isn't afraid to call someone out on their mistakes. I respect norm, as he isn't trying to be condesending, it is just his "way". You don't like it to bad for you. My woodshop teacher was like norm is, but he knew his stuff and I really miss him, he was a nice guy, just don't make a mistake and attempt to argue that you're right. You probably aren't, seriously. That simple. This from a 14 year old kid. Guys, grow up and grow some thicker skin!