Restoration of my 71 Olds....Help!

[Ironsoul9]

I have owned this 1971 Cutlass convertible for 10 years. After I drove it and showed it for a few years I decided to take it to a well known restoration shop and have some of the rust knocked out of the quarters and a new paint job on the car. I dropped the car off in October of 2003. I just asked for the car to be brought back to me after 4 years and over 200,000 dollars invested in this project....I know what you all are saying, but I trusted these guys and once I was in for 100k, I thought that I had to finish this project and I kept cutting the checks. Anyway, The car is now in my garage-The interior is not started, no top, the bumpers are not on it and I can't drive it. I am upset and I want to know what I can do?? I took all the restoration pictures(over 200) and all the invoices(Over 200) to a lawyer to look at-He suggests that I find another restoration expert to look at the pics and invoices to find out how much I was overcharged for the work. BTW-The labor was agreed upon at 40.00/hour (Pretty good rate) and I bought 98% of the parts for the restoration. Do I have a case? What should I do next? If anyone out there knows how to help me please let me know at Ironsoul9@aol.com. Thanks in advance.

[J-(Chicago)]

?
?

They say cars are only worth what someone will pay you for them.

I personally would only pay $8000 for a near mint 71, but then again, they are not my favorite car either.

They're all just hunks of steel when you get down to it. So a 4000 pound hunk of steel with scrap steel payout at 4 cents a pound, would= 160 bucks, plus what you can sell the remaining parts for.

Most of the high prices are generated by respect for creative design and American craftsmanship in my opinion. And also in a distant 3rd and 4th place, are personal emotional attachment, and the ever stalking, jackthe price up because it is rare.

[J-(Chicago)]

Some people would say..... 8 grand?!?! how dare you disrespect this fine craftsmanship with that lowball offer.
and I could reply... Because it's an ugly piece of sh1t.

No way to tell who is right or wrong.

[kevinkpk]

Originally Posted by Ironsoul9

I have owned this 1971 Cutlass convertible for 10 years. After I drove it and showed it for a few years I decided to take it to a well known restoration shop and have some of the rust knocked out of the quarters and a new paint job on the car. I dropped the car off in October of 2003. I just asked for the car to be brought back to me after 4 years and over 200,000 dollars invested in this project....I know what you all are saying, but I trusted these guys and once I was in for 100k, I thought that I had to finish this project and I kept cutting the checks. Anyway, The car is now in my garage-The interior is not started, no top, the bumpers are not on it and I can't drive it. I am upset and I want to know what I can do?? I took all the restoration pictures(over 200) and all the invoices(Over 200) to a lawyer to look at-He suggests that I find another restoration expert to look at the pics and invoices to find out how much I was overcharged for the work. BTW-The labor was agreed upon at 40.00/hour (Pretty good rate) and I bought 98% of the parts for the restoration. Do I have a case? What should I do next? If anyone out there knows how to help me please let me know at Ironsoul9@aol.com. Thanks in advance.

Let me get this straight, you have paid over 200,000 dollars (US?)?
Forty bucks an hour is VERY reasonable, but do the math...............

[Oldsguy]

I would contact a representative from the local branch of the Oldsmobile Club of America and ask them for help. They will most likely know of a knowledgeable restoration expert who knows Oldsmobile cars specifically and will be able to look at your receipts and pictures and even the car for that matter and give you a second opinion your lawyer might be able to use legally. Texasred is a member of his local OCA branch and can give you a good contact. PM him and see. And, good luck.

[Ironsoul9]

Thanks for the response. I am a member of OCA as well and I have contacted my cars' year/model advisor already and a couple of other members that are giving me some advice. I have not contacted Texasred though. I will see if I can look him up in the Journey With Olds and send him a note. Thanks again.

[oldsmobile1915]

Hey Oldsguy - good tip... and IronSoul9... I feel bad for you. I am working on a website for older Oldsmobiles, and although this 71 Cutlass convertible is kinda new, there is information on "Restoration Shop Considerations" and tips for how to "Restore It Yourself" that you may find beneficial.

http://www.geocities.com/mymerryoldsmobile

How many hours did they truly put into the car? Unless you are going for a concours restoration and it's a super rare car with a lot of sentimental value, you should try to keep your costs to be what you can get it for at an auction... For those of us who actually restores cars, this never happens.

Check out the website and see what it says.

All the best and keep us posted... I'd like to see how you make out.


~Joe

[Ironsoul9]

Thanks for the advice Joe. I will NEVER make that mistake again. If I ever recover from this fiasco I will buy my next car complete and not let my personal attachment to a vehicle cloud my judgement.

[Ironsoul9]

I have located someone to come and look at the Olds in the next couple of weeks to determine if and how much I got taken for. Thanks to all that have sent me emails and given me some advice. It's nice to have fellow Olds fans and OCA members to lean on when in trouble.

[68conv455]

On the TV show Wrecks to Riches they overhauled cars for $50-$70K (professional work). Then they auctioned them and sometimes made a profit sometimes didn't. Sorry to hear about your circumstances. Good Luck. I hope you get something back.

[Ironsoul9]

The biggest issue I have is that if I get this thing all the way to court and I somehow lose the case then I am out some more money and what little dignity I have left.....Things are progressing well so far in preparation of a court case. Thanks for the response.

[71rocket]

Don't you mean 20,000 dollars??

[Jokers69]

Two Hundred Thousand Dollars? I would say they overcharged you at least One Hundred Ninety Seven Thousand Dollars and Thirty Eight cents.

[Olds64]

I certainly hope you made a typo and only spent $20,000. If you did spend $200,000 then you might have trouble in a court case. Don't they base civil law suits off of what a "reasonable" person would have done? $200,000 for any Oldsmobile other than a 1897 Runabout is unreasonable.

[Ironsoul9]

No Typo guys. It was 200k not 20k. I know what you are all thinking, but I am not a complete fool-Well, OK, I am. Part of the problem was that growing up in (Columbus, KS) I had a 69 442 and I loved that car-My Father made me sell it because I was caught drag racing in Baxter Springs, KS for the 2nd time. After I sold it, I promised myself that if I ever got another one I would do whatever I had to do to keep it. When I bought the car I currently own when I could finally afford it-on the drive back home with the top down and the rocket rumbling I said out loud-"I will never get rid of this car". So after driving and showing it for a few years I took it to the restoration shop and so goes the story. One thing led to another and once I was in it for a certain amount I kept saying " Just 5-10 more grand and it will be done...Now here I am in this dilemma and I need some help to recover some of my hard earned dough.

[Olds64]

[kevinkpk]

Originally Posted by Ironsoul9

No Typo guys. It was 200k not 20k. I know what you are all thinking, but I am not a complete fool-Well, OK, I am. Part of the problem was that growing up in (Columbus, KS) I had a 69 442 and I loved that car-My Father made me sell it because I was caught drag racing in Baxter Springs, KS for the 2nd time. After I sold it, I promised myself that if I ever got another one I would do whatever I had to do to keep it. When I bought the car I currently own when I could finally afford it-on the drive back home with the top down and the rocket rumbling I said out loud-"I will never get rid of this car". So after driving and showing it for a few years I took it to the restoration shop and so goes the story. One thing led to another and once I was in it for a certain amount I kept saying " Just 5-10 more grand and it will be done...Now here I am in this dilemma and I need some help to recover some of my hard earned dough.

Sheesh, I don't know what to say other than, money is just that. Since you've spent that amount on something you really want, I say GOOD FOR YOU! I don't know how to help, other than get hourly cost's in your area from a reputable restoration shop, then proceed from there, best of luck.

[71rocket]

Sorry for your predicament. Old car passion can be as bad as buck fever. If you ever get back for the holidays drop me a PM.

[Ironsoul9]

What part of SEK do you live in?

[71rocket]

North of Parsons.

[Olds64]

There isn't much in that area of KS. I used to live in the booming metropolis of Pittsburg.

[kevinkpk]

Originally Posted by 71rocket

North of Parsons.

Thinking Sedan, Ks? I go through there (now alot) Parsons, I cannot place............

[Ironsoul9]

I went to High School in Columbus and graduated College at "The Pittsburg State University". Used to play alot of football-baseball-Golf in Parsons and the surrounding areas. Small world.

[Olds64]

I used to be a Rotarian in Pittsburg, it is a great community. My job also took me to the surrounding communities of Ft. Scott, Baxter Springs, Galena, Columbus, etc. I also went into Missouri quite often around Lamar, Nevada, and Golden City. Great area!

[71rocket]

Originally Posted by kevinkpk

Thinking Sedan, Ks? I go through there (now alot) Parsons, I cannot place............

Parsons is NE of Sedan. The Chatauqua Hills around Sedan are pretty.

[Ironsoul9]

71 is my favorite body style for Cutlasses...Your 71 Cutlass looks great.

[71rocket]

Originally Posted by Ironsoul9

71 is my favorite body style for Cutlasses...Your 71 Cutlass looks great.

Thanks. I've had it painted since that photo and it has now resided in my mechanics shop for the past 6 weeks to get a vacuum leak fixed. I wish I had a heated shop.

[Olds64]

I wish I had a shop, even if it wasn't heated. LoL

71Rocket, have you ever been by Scotty Bitner's shop N of Pittsburg on 69? It is on the E side of the highway. I think it is just called Scott's Classic Cars. He always has a couple of cars sitting out in front of his shop for sale. Plus he has some AWSOME classics for sale inside of the shop. He has a garge in back where he has his on going projects. He also sells novelty items and automotive memorabilia. You should stop by and visit him some time.

[Ironsoul9]

I visit Bitner's shop every time I am in town. I usually fly into KCI and then I drive to Columbus right past his awesome facility. The Bitner's have been a fixture in the Pittsburg community for years. He always has great looking classics inside and out. You have to check it out if you are close.

[71rocket]

I've been by there, just never stopped in.

[Olds64]

You should check out Scotty's shop next time you are in the area. You could even drive your Cutlass and let him take a look at it. I am sure he would get a kick out of it. He is an awsome guy!

[Ironsoul9]

I could still use some help finding someone to go thru the receipts and pictures to see if I can drag the restoration shop to court to try to recover some of my money back. Any guidance would be much appreciated.

[71rocket]

I'd take all the info to other reputable body shops and get their opinion. If they think it's out of line contact an attorney.

[Ironsoul9]

I am still working on finding a shop that is not close to where I live. The restoration shop I used is very well know and I don't want to tip my hand. I have a lead on a friend of mine that owns a shop in Columbus where I grew up. (DePratts autobody). Thanks for the advice 71 Rocket

[rrielley]

Ironsoul: If you haven't filed a complaint yet with the Better Business Bureau and/or Chamber of Commerce, I would certainly suggest you look into that. These con men will certainly do the same thing to the next guy they can if they aren't stopped.

If my father made me get rid of a 1969 442, he'd turn up missing.

However, that would never happen with me...my dad would be there at the drag strip watching!

[Ironsoul9]

Here is the story of how I was made to get rid of the Olds. I was caught racing it in Baxter Springs KS. The guy I was racing challenged me and I followed him to the local 1/4 mile-not knowing that it was also some local speed trap. Anyway, I was a couple of car lengths ahead of his "Fire-Chicken" and then all of sudden the cherries and sirens were everywhere-It ended up costing me almost a grand. When my father found out he said that either you sell the car or you move out right now. Confused, I sold the car and then moved out a couple of months later anyway. I was 17. This was in 1983-I had no idea what I had other than one super hot Oldsmobile...Hind sight says-keep the car and move out-But I didn't and here I am making another bad decision involving an Oldsmobile. I AM SICK!!!!