Reducing roll in 71 Cutlass

[iuhoops83]

I am working on reducing roll in my 71 Cutlass. The car is in pretty good shape, but has significant roll. To date, I have replaced the front and rear springs and shocks (now using Gabriel gas charged). Also replaced the center link and lower ball joints. The car improved, but still has quite a bit of roll. I recently drove an old 70 cutlass that needed a restoration and it actually had tighter steering and less roll than my car, even though it was in pretty rough shape. Any suggestions on next steps?

1. Should I change the gear box?
2. How do I determine if the front sway bar is still effective?
3. Other major areas to check?

Thanks. Larry

[Olds64]

Have you replaced the rag joint in the steering column?

I don't believe a sway bar is a wear item. All you have to do is replace the bushings. If you haven't done the control arm bushings and upper ball joints you should. In fact, I would suggest doing an entire front end rebuild kit. You can get them from PST.

[iuhoops83]

Have not replaced the rag joint. Is that a simple change? I was hoping not to hear control arm bushings. That's seems like major work, but sounds like it is needed. Guess they could be changed when I have the upper ball joints changed.

[Olds64]

The rag joint is 4 bolts. You can do it while standing at the front of the car, or side (depends on how tall you are).

If you did the lower ball joints the upper ball joints and control arm bushings aren't much more difficult. Just more labor intensive.

[Lady72nRob71]

Although you do not want to hear this, the control arm bushings need replacing, if they had not been done within the last 15 years or so if the car was driven a lot.
The rubber softens and breaks down with age, twisting motion from driving, ozone, and natural deterioration.

The rear control arm bushings should be treated the same way.

What size sway bar (dia) is on the front?

Do you have the rear sway bar and boxed rear lower contol arms?

Have the rubber body mounts been replaced in the last 15 years?
If not, they will need it too. Get the kit with the hardware, as some bolts may need to be cut off due to rust bond.

ALL of these items, along with springs & a quick-ratio steering box are going to be done to my '72 late next year. From what I can tell she is all original and there is a lot of body roll. It will be costly, but will be a huge improvement.

I did the complete front end of my 78 Ford and it rides as good as any new car in its class.


--"What is the hardest part about restoring an old car?







--Paying for it!!!"

[joe_padavano]

I'll echo what Rob said. Note that the steering box and linkage has nothing to do with roll, but lots to do with handling feel.

First order of business is to ensure the suspension (front and back) is in good condition. Next is anti-sway bars. The A-body cars are notorious for understeer; fixing this usually means a larger rear bar. I like a 1 1/4" or larger front bar and at least a 1 1/4" rear bar. You can use a 1 1/4" front bar from a WS6 Trans Am, but a rear bar that large will be aftermarket.

Finally, a quick ratio steering box will make a lot of difference in the feel of the car.

[iuhoops83]

Rob,
All great advice. Thanks. Car does not have a rear sway bar. I'll have my mechanic check into your suggestion. Is the rear sway bar necessary for standard driving? I don't know the size of the front sway bar, but it looks original to the car. I do notice the car is easy to push side to side. Could be the body bushings.

What is a modified steering box?

Thanks. Here's a pic. Larry

[Lady72nRob71]

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

You can use a 1 1/4" front bar from a WS6 Trans Am, but a rear bar that large will be aftermarket.

Is there an interchange guide for suspension parts somewhere? I thought there was at one point.
I saw a firebird formula in a yard last year with the big sway bar and I 'heard' it would fit my 72... However I did not know what years would be interchangable. Yards in Dallas are often costly (cannot pull yourself) so I did not gamble it.

[Lady72nRob71]

Originally Posted by iuhoops83

Rob,
All great advice. Thanks. Car does not have a rear sway bar. I'll have my mechanic check into your suggestion. Is the rear sway bar necessary for standard driving? I don't know the size of the front sway bar, but it looks original to the car. I do notice the car is easy to push side to side. Could be the body bushings.

What is a modified steering box?

Thanks. Here's a pic. Larry

Nice looking car Larry!

All the Olds parts houses sell quick ratio steering boxes that have a decreased gear ratio for increased (human) arm effort and less turns lock to lock. I think they are 12.7 to 1 versus the stock 16 to 1 or somewhere around there. A smaller turn on the steering wheel causes more steer in your car. It will feel firmer doing straight ahead, too with less "corrections" needed by the driver.

If you have a complaint on body roll, then you may need a rear way bar!
Regular driving oftn involves quick turns which are safer and more accurate with a rear bar. There are kits available from OPG to "box" the lower control arms for installing the rear bar. The just weld onto your existing arms. Boxed arms are mandatory for using a rear bar.

The bushings will cure a lot of the problems, especially if they are original.

[Bubba57]

My 70 had the same problems, I rebuilt the front end utilizing polyurethane bushings where I could, I would recommend getting the greasable kind if you can as these tend to squeek. I boxed the lower control arms on the rear and with stock anti sway bars has really helped cornering. These cars still have a bit of understeer as Joe pointed out, but is significantly reduced using poly...

[gearheads78]

Lots of good info listed. If you want to take it to the next lever you might want to check out Chevelles.com and spend some time doing searches in the protouring and suspension forums. Everything is the same on the Olds a-bodies. I want mine to suprise the guy in a modern sports car.

[KeithA0000]

That's a beautiful car.

[71rocket]

Nice '71!

[mugzilla]

I use cargo coil (var ratio) rear springs ...

[redoldsman]

If you decide to change the steering to a quick ratio box, you can send yours to Chip at Power Steering Service, Inc in Springfield, MO. He is a really nice guy and an Oldsmobile owner. He rebuilt a power steering unit for me for a 54 Olds and did a great job. His website is www.powersteering.com.