bainer1290

I am going to look at this car this weekend. Original engine and trans are long gone but it comes with what I am told is a 1970 455 and a TH400. I had another thread in the engine section so I know what to look for on the engine to ID it but curious about what to look for on the car itself. I've been doing some research, got the VIN decoder, etc but is there a way to tell the options it had from the vin tag?

Is this the stock hood for a 72 Cutlass S, looks like it has vents on the sides?

What should I look for, any common problem areas for a 72 Cutlass? Rust?

Thank you

tru-blue 442

I thought the S model had the raised
type hood. (in the front)
Areas prone to rust are lower front cowl,
and the package tray lower, at the bottom
of the back glass. Front fender heels and lower
rear qrts.
Good luck, looks pretty solid from the 2 pics.

bainer1290

Thanks for the info on the rust areas.

For the hood do you mean the one with the 2 intakes/scoops? I had thought that was the 442 hood style, but I don't know much on these cars yet, just learning...

tru-blue 442

No, I wasn't referring to the ram air hood.
The Cutlass S and regular 442 had a twin
buldge in the front of the hood. I know that
they did in 69 and 70. But I am not sure as
far as the 71-72's go.

4speed455

That hood is correct. It has the chrome louvres. That right for 71-72 cutlass S and non w25 442.

vette442

That is the correct hood for a 71-72 Cutlass S, with the louvers. The cowl tag will show the original color combo and interior trim (A51 for buckets, sometimes an A52 designation for bench seat). Not much else in the way of options is shown on the cowl tag in 1972.

Terry

4speed455

Beat you to it. Lol.

bainer1290

Great info thank you, we'll see how it turns out hope it looks good in person.

joe_padavano

Nope. All the VIN from a 1972 Cutlass will tell you is the division (Oldsmobile), model, body style, engine, assembly plant, and model year. Unlike Pontiacs, there is no list that can cross reference an Oldsmobile VIN to a build sheet.

Diego

To clarify, you can get invoices from Pontiac Historical Services and find out how a car was equipped. Otherwise, the VIN will tell the items listed above, which was standard practice for all American vehicles starting in 1972.

bainer1290

Got it, well if I end up bringing it home I will take lots of pictures and hopefully you experts will be able to help me identify some options that it had.

bainer1290

Well I ended up getting the car, body seems to be in really good shape a few areas that need a bit of work but overall almost no rust. The interior needs a bit more love but it's a project. Car turned out to have ps, pb, front discs and it was a bucket seat car which is exactly what I wanted. The buckets are gone and there are a few other parts missing but the trunk is full of pieces so need to go through it to see what I need.

1970cs

Because of the center diffusers on the dash and the location of the heater core inlet/outlet plus the patch panels on the firewall I would be safe to say that it did have A/C. The picture of the interior does not show that climate control panel.

Pat

bainer1290

Good one, I saw that patch panel on the firewall and thought it might have been a/c at one time.

bainer1290

The firs thalf of the VIN is 3G87J2Z which shows the car originally had a 350 2bbl with dual exhaust. What do you think the rear end gear is? It's a 10 bolt.

1970cs

spec sheet on 350 2bbl. 2.73,3.08 or 3.23 with auto trans.

Pat

bainer1290

So there's a few possibilities, guess I'll have to open it up and go from there.

With my plans to build a street 455, TH400, goal of around 400hp/500tq at the crank would any of those gears be a bad combo with the engine?

Allan R

The car is a Freemont build and they're noted (but not guaranteed) for leaving build sheets on top of the gas tank. If the tank has never been out of your car there's a really good chance you'll find the information you're looking for. Gas tanks aren't all that hard to remove if you want to check. The majority of Cutlass S cars I've seen came with 2.73 gears. (axle code SA). You can verify the gears several ways. Easiest way is to change the differential fluid and look at the numbers stamped on the ring gear.

As both you and Pat noted, the J code in the engine position of the VIN means it had the N10 option from the factory. This was simply a block off plate on the stock exhaust on the passenger side, not special manifolds like the 455 has. J code had an extra 15 hp over the base H code 350, and 50 hp less than the M code 350 4bbl dual exhaust. Since you have a blank pallet, paint whatever engine pic you see in there.

bainer1290

Hey Allan, you are close to me I am in Lethbridge.

The gas tank is gone so no luck there... The car came with a 71 455/TH400 combo, currently stripping it down and going to get it into the machine shop shortly to have it checked out then the build can begin.

I plan to open up the rear end so at that time I will find the numbers on the gears.

The 455 I have seems to have an exhaust block-off plate on the passenger side too, is this standard for 455's?

vette442

For a Fremont '72, check under the package tray below the rear window for an 8.5 x 11 build sheet, unless that panel has already been pulled out over the years.

Allan R

Lethbridge? Ahh, the city of WIND!! Love the wind 'gage'. First time I saw it was back in the 90's visiting my GF at the time. For those who don't know about wind??


From 1970 all the 442's came with a 455, and there were a fair number of them in the CS and lower trim cars too. Unless the car was a 442 though you'd see very few of the others with dual exhaust. My guess is that your engine came from a CS/f85/Cutlass/Cutlass S with a 455 single exhaust. Does the block off plate look like this, only rustier?



If it does the engine likely was in an N10 optioned 455 from the factory. The W/Z dual exhaust manifolds were installed on all the 1970, 71 442's. In 1972 it was only standard on the 442 W30.

There's a few guys down your way from CO; closer to Calgary, Didsbury and Cochrane.

don71

That looks like a good project, not bad at all. I agree it looks like it had AC, though I don't see the plastic vents on the bottom of the dash. Easy to lose..

One thing cought my attention in pic five of the engine bay. Those engine frame mounts don't look Olds to me. Sure looks like chevy clam shell units.

bainer1290

Not sure what motors were in it before, apparently it was in Montana for the previous 20 years but motor was pulled by the owner before the one I purchased it from so not too many details from the seller...

haha wind gauge thats funny Allan. But you are right we do get our share of wind here but also chinooks in the winter, almost no snow on the ground as of now...

Yeah that looks like the blockoff plate from the 455. I'm pretty sure it is not a special 455 as it has low compression pistons, G heads, but a 4 barrel stock intake? It also think it has a cruise control vacuum setup bolted to the alternator bracket? Serial# indicates its a 1971 engine. I am thinking of getting headers so are those stock manifolds any good or not?

bainer1290

Here's a few pics of the manifolds.

And is that a cruise controller top right beside the alternator?

Allan R

1. If the engine is 71, the heads are probably the ones it was built with. The G heads are good for unleaded gas as the valve seats were hardened steel. You're right that the 71 455 was lower CR - 8.5:1 but it's still a nice engine even as stock. You could bolt up headers to this engine or go with a set of W/Z manifolds.

2. Yes that is a CC servo and mount; only 2 parts of many that make up the CC. Too bad the rest of the CC isn't there. If the diaphragm (rubber) is still soft, not cracked and retains vacuum LMK, I'd be an interested buyer.

This engine was also taken from an A/C car as noted by the alternator mounted on the DS and the 3 hole pulley on the PS pump. Heads and block look to be in very nice shape. Minimal machining likely. The senders in the block say it was an idiot light car too instead of gages. The battery cables should be replaced as they have temporary terminal clamps on them.

bainer1290

What model car do you think this engine came from?

For the G heads is it possible to put in larger intake valves, or is it not worth it?

Allan R

There's no real way to know. All you can determine from the stamping pad is
Division - (3)
Model year - (1)
Plant - (M, R, F, G, Z)
123456 - last 6 digits of the donor cars VIN sequence.

bainer1290

Yeah I sorta figured no real way to track it down...

bainer1290

Well no build sheet on the rear tray, but I did find this tube looking thing behind the rear seat, what is it?

oldsguybry

Vapor Canister .... I think

Allan R

It is the top part of the emissions vapor cannister. There are rubber vent lines (from the fuel tank) that connect to it underneath the car.

Here's a pic showing the 'plumbing'. The 3 lines with silver tubing are the vents from the fuel tank. The other one at the top left is the vent to the front charcoal canister at the right front fender. I just finished rebuilding the back of my car. This is one of the many pics I took documenting everything; this was taken just prior to installing the new fuel tank.

bainer1290

Thank you again

bainer1290

Trying to figure out this rear end ratio, what can you tell me from this picture? Are there part numbers hiding somewhere on the ring gear or ???

Allan R

It's an open carrier and the gear mesh pattern looks REALLY good. It was time to change that gear oil by the look of it. When filling up with new - use 80/90 conventional gear oil.

Jack up and put axle stands under the axle tubes. Put the trans in neutral and slowly move the drivers side tire forward. On the side of the ring gear you should see some numbers and letters stamped into it. Record them.
Most likely you have a 2.73 ratio the numbers you should find are 15 / 41 (pinion/ring). If the numbers are 13 / 40, they are 3.08

Here's a pic of the numbers on my 3.42:1 ring (sorry it's a little blurred but you get the idea)

bainer1290

Thank you Allan, looks like 2.73 thre is a 41 and 15 on the ring gear.

On a side note I ended up finding a parts car that I am going to look at this weekend, fingers crossed it should have some of the parts I am missing plus a complete interior that was recently redone.

bainer1290

Got the parts car home last night, digging into the interior, came across something to do with the blower. My car was a/c and the blower duct/condenser is missing so I am not sure what to do. Looks like the previous owner was just not going to have heat or fresh air as he covered up the hole to the blower?

I can fabricate something up using the blower cover from the parts car, then make a duct over to where the regular a/c vent connected or I could take everything out of the parts car. If I put the parts car blower, heater core in I would need to cut into the firewall to make new holes. Also I noticed the a/c unit is vacuum driven and the parts care one is not. If it helps I am taking the dash from the parts car as its interior is much nicer. Any recommendations on keeping the current a/c heater in or go with the non-ac one?

bainer1290

Or maybe I should just put an a/c blower box on it?

bainer1290

Pulled the gas tank and diff cover off the parts car, found the build sheet on the tank, Allan you will like this its an Edmonton Cutlass!!!

Also the diff looks to be a limited slip looks like its a 3.70???

sammy

A Fremont car shipped to an Edmonton dealer...
Your build sheet is a great find and is in really good shape!
Preserve it(frame)...it is an important part of your car's history....

bainer1290

It is definitely super cool but its not from my car its from my parts car, I guess some of those pieces will be part of my car though so it is a part of it. I will definitely frame it.