1972 Cutlass S ?
#1
1972 Cutlass S ?
I am going to look at this car this weekend. Original engine and trans are long gone but it comes with what I am told is a 1970 455 and a TH400. I had another thread in the engine section so I know what to look for on the engine to ID it but curious about what to look for on the car itself. I've been doing some research, got the VIN decoder, etc but is there a way to tell the options it had from the vin tag?
Is this the stock hood for a 72 Cutlass S, looks like it has vents on the sides?
What should I look for, any common problem areas for a 72 Cutlass? Rust?
Thank you
Is this the stock hood for a 72 Cutlass S, looks like it has vents on the sides?
What should I look for, any common problem areas for a 72 Cutlass? Rust?
Thank you
Last edited by bainer1290; January 13th, 2014 at 07:35 PM.
#2
I thought the S model had the raised
type hood. (in the front)
Areas prone to rust are lower front cowl,
and the package tray lower, at the bottom
of the back glass. Front fender heels and lower
rear qrts.
Good luck, looks pretty solid from the 2 pics.
type hood. (in the front)
Areas prone to rust are lower front cowl,
and the package tray lower, at the bottom
of the back glass. Front fender heels and lower
rear qrts.
Good luck, looks pretty solid from the 2 pics.
#4
No, I wasn't referring to the ram air hood.
The Cutlass S and regular 442 had a twin
buldge in the front of the hood. I know that
they did in 69 and 70. But I am not sure as
far as the 71-72's go.
The Cutlass S and regular 442 had a twin
buldge in the front of the hood. I know that
they did in 69 and 70. But I am not sure as
far as the 71-72's go.
#6
That is the correct hood for a 71-72 Cutlass S, with the louvers. The cowl tag will show the original color combo and interior trim (A51 for buckets, sometimes an A52 designation for bench seat). Not much else in the way of options is shown on the cowl tag in 1972.
Terry
Terry
Last edited by vette442; January 13th, 2014 at 09:00 PM.
#9
Nope. All the VIN from a 1972 Cutlass will tell you is the division (Oldsmobile), model, body style, engine, assembly plant, and model year. Unlike Pontiacs, there is no list that can cross reference an Oldsmobile VIN to a build sheet.
#10
To clarify, you can get invoices from Pontiac Historical Services and find out how a car was equipped. Otherwise, the VIN will tell the items listed above, which was standard practice for all American vehicles starting in 1972.
#12
Well I ended up getting the car, body seems to be in really good shape a few areas that need a bit of work but overall almost no rust. The interior needs a bit more love but it's a project. Car turned out to have ps, pb, front discs and it was a bucket seat car which is exactly what I wanted. The buckets are gone and there are a few other parts missing but the trunk is full of pieces so need to go through it to see what I need.
#13
Because of the center diffusers on the dash and the location of the heater core inlet/outlet plus the patch panels on the firewall I would be safe to say that it did have A/C. The picture of the interior does not show that climate control panel.
Pat
Pat
#17
So there's a few possibilities, guess I'll have to open it up and go from there.
With my plans to build a street 455, TH400, goal of around 400hp/500tq at the crank would any of those gears be a bad combo with the engine?
With my plans to build a street 455, TH400, goal of around 400hp/500tq at the crank would any of those gears be a bad combo with the engine?
#18
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
As both you and Pat noted, the J code in the engine position of the VIN means it had the N10 option from the factory. This was simply a block off plate on the stock exhaust on the passenger side, not special manifolds like the 455 has. J code had an extra 15 hp over the base H code 350, and 50 hp less than the M code 350 4bbl dual exhaust. Since you have a blank pallet, paint whatever engine pic you see in there.
#19
Hey Allan, you are close to me I am in Lethbridge.
The gas tank is gone so no luck there... The car came with a 71 455/TH400 combo, currently stripping it down and going to get it into the machine shop shortly to have it checked out then the build can begin.
I plan to open up the rear end so at that time I will find the numbers on the gears.
The 455 I have seems to have an exhaust block-off plate on the passenger side too, is this standard for 455's?
The gas tank is gone so no luck there... The car came with a 71 455/TH400 combo, currently stripping it down and going to get it into the machine shop shortly to have it checked out then the build can begin.
I plan to open up the rear end so at that time I will find the numbers on the gears.
The 455 I have seems to have an exhaust block-off plate on the passenger side too, is this standard for 455's?
#21
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
From 1970 all the 442's came with a 455, and there were a fair number of them in the CS and lower trim cars too. Unless the car was a 442 though you'd see very few of the others with dual exhaust. My guess is that your engine came from a CS/f85/Cutlass/Cutlass S with a 455 single exhaust. Does the block off plate look like this, only rustier?
If it does the engine likely was in an N10 optioned 455 from the factory. The W/Z dual exhaust manifolds were installed on all the 1970, 71 442's. In 1972 it was only standard on the 442 W30.
There's a few guys down your way from CO; closer to Calgary, Didsbury and Cochrane.
#22
Well I ended up getting the car, body seems to be in really good shape a few areas that need a bit of work but overall almost no rust. The interior needs a bit more love but it's a project. Car turned out to have ps, pb, front discs and it was a bucket seat car which is exactly what I wanted. The buckets are gone and there are a few other parts missing but the trunk is full of pieces so need to go through it to see what I need.
One thing cought my attention in pic five of the engine bay. Those engine frame mounts don't look Olds to me. Sure looks like chevy clam shell units.
#23
Not sure what motors were in it before, apparently it was in Montana for the previous 20 years but motor was pulled by the owner before the one I purchased it from so not too many details from the seller...
haha wind gauge thats funny Allan. But you are right we do get our share of wind here but also chinooks in the winter, almost no snow on the ground as of now...
Yeah that looks like the blockoff plate from the 455. I'm pretty sure it is not a special 455 as it has low compression pistons, G heads, but a 4 barrel stock intake? It also think it has a cruise control vacuum setup bolted to the alternator bracket? Serial# indicates its a 1971 engine. I am thinking of getting headers so are those stock manifolds any good or not?
haha wind gauge thats funny Allan. But you are right we do get our share of wind here but also chinooks in the winter, almost no snow on the ground as of now...
Yeah that looks like the blockoff plate from the 455. I'm pretty sure it is not a special 455 as it has low compression pistons, G heads, but a 4 barrel stock intake? It also think it has a cruise control vacuum setup bolted to the alternator bracket? Serial# indicates its a 1971 engine. I am thinking of getting headers so are those stock manifolds any good or not?
Last edited by bainer1290; January 21st, 2014 at 02:36 PM.
#25
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
2. Yes that is a CC servo and mount; only 2 parts of many that make up the CC. Too bad the rest of the CC isn't there. If the diaphragm (rubber) is still soft, not cracked and retains vacuum LMK, I'd be an interested buyer.
This engine was also taken from an A/C car as noted by the alternator mounted on the DS and the 3 hole pulley on the PS pump. Heads and block look to be in very nice shape. Minimal machining likely. The senders in the block say it was an idiot light car too instead of gages. The battery cables should be replaced as they have temporary terminal clamps on them.
#27
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
There's no real way to know. All you can determine from the stamping pad is
Division - (3)
Model year - (1)
Plant - (M, R, F, G, Z)
123456 - last 6 digits of the donor cars VIN sequence.
Division - (3)
Model year - (1)
Plant - (M, R, F, G, Z)
123456 - last 6 digits of the donor cars VIN sequence.
#31
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Here's a pic showing the 'plumbing'. The 3 lines with silver tubing are the vents from the fuel tank. The other one at the top left is the vent to the front charcoal canister at the right front fender. I just finished rebuilding the back of my car. This is one of the many pics I took documenting everything; this was taken just prior to installing the new fuel tank.
#34
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
It's an open carrier and the gear mesh pattern looks REALLY good. It was time to change that gear oil by the look of it. When filling up with new - use 80/90 conventional gear oil.
Jack up and put axle stands under the axle tubes. Put the trans in neutral and slowly move the drivers side tire forward. On the side of the ring gear you should see some numbers and letters stamped into it. Record them.
Most likely you have a 2.73 ratio the numbers you should find are 15 / 41 (pinion/ring). If the numbers are 13 / 40, they are 3.08
Here's a pic of the numbers on my 3.42:1 ring (sorry it's a little blurred but you get the idea)
Jack up and put axle stands under the axle tubes. Put the trans in neutral and slowly move the drivers side tire forward. On the side of the ring gear you should see some numbers and letters stamped into it. Record them.
Most likely you have a 2.73 ratio the numbers you should find are 15 / 41 (pinion/ring). If the numbers are 13 / 40, they are 3.08
Here's a pic of the numbers on my 3.42:1 ring (sorry it's a little blurred but you get the idea)
#35
Thank you Allan, looks like 2.73 thre is a 41 and 15 on the ring gear.
On a side note I ended up finding a parts car that I am going to look at this weekend, fingers crossed it should have some of the parts I am missing plus a complete interior that was recently redone.
On a side note I ended up finding a parts car that I am going to look at this weekend, fingers crossed it should have some of the parts I am missing plus a complete interior that was recently redone.
#36
Got the parts car home last night, digging into the interior, came across something to do with the blower. My car was a/c and the blower duct/condenser is missing so I am not sure what to do. Looks like the previous owner was just not going to have heat or fresh air as he covered up the hole to the blower?
I can fabricate something up using the blower cover from the parts car, then make a duct over to where the regular a/c vent connected or I could take everything out of the parts car. If I put the parts car blower, heater core in I would need to cut into the firewall to make new holes. Also I noticed the a/c unit is vacuum driven and the parts care one is not. If it helps I am taking the dash from the parts car as its interior is much nicer. Any recommendations on keeping the current a/c heater in or go with the non-ac one?
I can fabricate something up using the blower cover from the parts car, then make a duct over to where the regular a/c vent connected or I could take everything out of the parts car. If I put the parts car blower, heater core in I would need to cut into the firewall to make new holes. Also I noticed the a/c unit is vacuum driven and the parts care one is not. If it helps I am taking the dash from the parts car as its interior is much nicer. Any recommendations on keeping the current a/c heater in or go with the non-ac one?
Last edited by bainer1290; February 2nd, 2014 at 11:33 AM.
#38
Pulled the gas tank and diff cover off the parts car, found the build sheet on the tank, Allan you will like this its an Edmonton Cutlass!!!
Also the diff looks to be a limited slip looks like its a 3.70???
Also the diff looks to be a limited slip looks like its a 3.70???
Last edited by bainer1290; February 17th, 2014 at 06:57 PM.
#39
A Fremont car shipped to an Edmonton dealer...
Your build sheet is a great find and is in really good shape!
Preserve it(frame)...it is an important part of your car's history....
Your build sheet is a great find and is in really good shape!
Preserve it(frame)...it is an important part of your car's history....