getawaycar

I thought that would get your attention. I came across this car on my local craigslist and thought it might make for some interesting discussion. I work on a lot of CNG product and although it burns reasonably clean, the overall thermal efficiency of the fuel and the performance are noticeably less than other fuels, and the engine failure rate is much higher. Not qualities I myself am looking for in a muscle car, but to each his own I suppose.

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/cto/2644048540.html

This is a 1972 Oldsmobile 442 convertible that is capable of running on both gasoline and Natural Gas. The Natural gas is better know as compressed Natural Gas or CNG. That makes this monster muscle car cleaner than any Hybrid! The benefits are many including a public price for fuel of $2.00 dollars a gallon (gasoline equivalent) and 85 cents a gallon when filling up at home! Yes,you can fill up at home and I do offer a home fueling station. I use one of the better ones and that retails for $8,500. Some units are as low as $3,500. What you get for the price is more hours and more fuel pumped per hour. these are intended to fill your car overnight. You have to have Natural Gas at your home. This 442 does not come with the home fueling station. If you like what you see I will be converting more affordable old muscle cars over the next few weeks including a 1966 Mustang. Please send me and email if you are interested in being old school green.

Firebrand

Interesting.

I still think eventually battery technology will become good enough that the alternative ways to power cars being fiddled with will disappear.

When that day comes, I'd be really inclined to take a Cutlass that has no motor and turn it into a daily driver with battery power. Certainly never meet your car's twin coming and going on the road.

And of course, I'll hopefully have a gasoline powered Cutlass just like the day it was built.

Aceshigh

Seriously ?? I always thought CNG would be the future. You get more bang for your buck with Natural Gas over Electricity too. We've done the math on this on basic home utilities on my other forums checking into it. So I don't think batteries are the wave of the future at all. I personally think diesels or diesel hybrids are the future. But the US refinery situation is 90% gasoline......so don't expect them to allow many more here.

Those Honda civic GX's sell like hotcakes and they have been gobbling them up all around the new Natural Gas reserves discovered in Salt Lake City area lately.

All of my emergency generators for my telecommunication hubsites run off Chevy V8's powered by natural gas too. I've always thought this would be the future.

MDchanic

I continue to be amazed that CNG / LPG powered cars are still a "Wow!" thing here, when this technology has been old, boring, and done-every-day common in Europe for over 20 years, especially since the US has such huge stores of cheap natural gas.

FWIW, the other disadvantage of CNG, for a passenger car that you actually use, is the space occupied by the tank - it takes up some of your trunk (trucks can put them in more creative places).

- Eric

garys 68

Had I known about home fueling, I would have considered a natural gas conversion for my 442 instead of the LSX motor.
The $4k tax credit for the convesion doesn't hurt either.

driverchoice

I never heard that the engine failure rate was high, i remember years back my mechanic friends use to love getting old natural gas ford engines out of the local utility trucks to convert to gas because they were in such good shape and so clean inside

rocketraider

Found a late-70s Thunderbird in a junkyard years ago with CNG conversion. Engine was marked good and the car had taken a pretty nasty t-bone hit.

Our two remote dam generators are AMC 258 sixes powered by LP gas. One of them can be a little cantankerous to start sometimes but that's because the vehicle mechanic at the plant is a slacker and doesn't maintain them unless he gets a trouble ticket. Keep telling him "this is part of the USGS water permit, they have to be ready to go at any time" but he's so close to retirement he doesn't care. Those little AMCs fire up and it's amazing how smooth they run on gas.

tomsw31

I have been running LPG (propane) in my Cutlass drivers since 1990. The cars run much cleaner, less maintainence, and propane runs about half the cost of gas. I changed the spark plugs after 100,000 miles only because I felt guilty, not because they showed any wear! The oil remains clean much longer and I do not need to need to change it as often. There is no apparent power loss and emissions testing is never an issue. In fact, it barely reads in all categories. The only issue I have is the lack of wide availability of propane refueling stations whenever I drive it to the U.S. It is widely available at gas station chains all across Canada. My current propane powered Cutlass is a 1972 Convertible.

Aceshigh

Europe is not the United States.

Would a space shuttle launching from Africa wow the natives ???
Well why would it ?? It's been in America for the past 50 years now.

Sounds dumb right ?

Aceshigh

CAN YOU PLEEEEEASE Start a thread and post all pics and info on this ???

I'd LOVE to see this.

MDchanic

Ask me in ten years, when the Chinese launch one from there.

I stick by my statement - natural gas is so cheap here, and so much cheaper than in Europe, and we already have so many LPG-powered vehicles in industry, such as forklifts, and even the floor buffers at my local supermarket, and the conversions are so relatively simple and so versatile (generally dual-fuel, as has been mentioned), that I stand in awe of the fact that the average American finds anything newsworthy in the conversions.

And as for the space shuttle in Africa - bad analogy.
I'd say plug-in electric cars would be a better one. Just like someone with a natural gas car would have trouble fueling up here in the US, someone with an electric car might have a b|+ch of a time plugging in over there.

I think the idea of shooting anything that moves in the woods behind your house, cooking and eating it would appeal on both continents, though, from what I've heard (possum stew, meet monkey burgers!) .

- Eric

Aceshigh

We weren't talking about refueling dilemma's, we were talking about fuel technologies this country hasn't explored on a large enough level yet.
Home charging/refueling options are available globally for purchase. Public infrastructure is another discussion.

Even if we switch to your analogy....
That's saying the Natives of Africa shouldn't be wowed at plug in hybrids just because America has had them now for years.
See......still dont' make sense. lol

Maybe I shouldn't be wowed when my plumber pulls my toilet bowl since China doesn't use toilet bowls. lol
You know I'm bustin yer nuggets right ??

tomsw31

Aces,
Follow this link for pics. http://rides.webshots.com/album/573251169ZznMAG

This is the second car I have had on propane. I was told that I would loss about 10 % in power loss. It is not noticeable however. The main reason is that the cfm of the carb is only 600. However if you ran a dual carb manifold, you could get around this issue. The advantage of propane is that you can run a much higher compression ratio without detonation, if you are going for a performance build. I saw a guy at the race track with a Cuda with a 440, 13 to 1 compression 2 lpg carbs (1200 cfm) into the 11,s. Propane injection on diesel trucks also boosts performance.
I did it originally in 1990 on a 1969 Cutlass to save money on fuel on a daily driven commuter car. That car got 15 mpg on gas before I converted it and then got 14 mpg on propane.

Vega

Jeese man, i hate these posts that even mention "alternative power" everyone jumps on the bandwagon to load you down with oppinions and rarely is there ever a fact, or a fact that holds truth anyway lol.

But i didnt just come here to troll lol. Im not really into CNG myself but i know how it feels to be a supporter of alternative fuel and have everyone at your throat about it haha. That said, good luck with the sale. It is definatly an interesting concept. Best of luck, keep us updated with any other cars you do! Olds or not, all of us here love classics Good luck!

MDchanic

Your plumber is Chinese?!?

- Eric

Red Delta

Doesn't propane have a stupid high octane rating?

We had an 80 GMC 3/4 ton that ran on propane. Nothing like the smell of rotten eggs in the morning.

I miss that truck.