1967 W30 442 rear end
#1
1967 W30 442 rear end
For sale is a mint condition 1967 W30 rear end. The unit is a 4 pinion, posi traction with 3:55 gears. Please call for info and pics..thanks!...618-282-6560 or email me at classics@htc.net
#2
For sale is a mint condition 1967 W30 rear end. The unit is a 4 pinion, posi traction with 3:55 gears. Please call for info and pics..thanks!...618-282-6560 or email me at classics@htc.net
#4
#5
I have limited knowledge on this but I am pretty sure the 4 pin cone type posi was used in others than just the W-30 cars and am pretty sure GTO also used it. I got one for my 67 project in 390 ratio.... Someone set me straight...
#6
I had a 67 442 convert with a 4 pinion, 3:90, ten bolt, 8.2 posi. It was axle code TH and mine was a non-W30 of course. SJ is the code for a 3:55 posi but I don't see any breakout for W-30 and non W-30. I thought all 67 W-30's had 3:90 geared 10 bolts? As far as I remember the 4 pinion 10 bolt posi was used in all 4 speed 442's in 1967.
Last edited by Four Four Tony; October 17th, 2010 at 06:57 PM.
#7
Henry
#8
I had a 67 442 convert with a 4 pinion, 3:90, ten bolt, 8.2 posi. It was axle code TH and mine was a non-W30 of course. SJ is the code for a 3:55 posi but I don't see any breakout for W-30 and non W-30. I thought all 67 W-30's had 3:90 geared 10 bolts? As far as I remember the 4 pinion 10 bolt posi was used in all 4 speed 442's in 1967.
'67 W30s had Q5/Q9 coded 4.33 gears as standard, with 3.90 and 3.55 optional. The W30s were the only cars to come with the 4.33s (and their Q5/Q9 codes) from the factory. So *that* would be the only thing that would identify the rear as being a W30 rear.
#10
I think you guys pretty much summed it up.I've had my fair share of the 4-pinion units,but most of them came from GTO rears.If that came from a 67 W30,then it was an earlier-dated car,as the later 67's started getting the 12-bolt O-axle.
#11
From what I understand, Olds started putting "non-performance" O-types in A-bodies starting circa late spring, but I can find no documentation of this.
But the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) were an option thru the end of the year. The P-type (G93 3.55 and G94 3.90) were still the standard issue thru the end of the year.
I have production figures that support this.
In fact, not many of the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) made it into production in '67: only approx 100 of each, and most of them during the last few months.
Last edited by wmachine; October 18th, 2010 at 08:24 AM.
#12
i do not believe that is true. None of the '67 w30s came with o-types. The o-type was originally slated to be used for the '67 w30s as late as december (still prior to when any were built), but early tests found them "shucking gears" in the o-types and they changed to the p-type with the 4-pinion carrier and went to 4.33 gears as standard. Word was the steeper gears for the o-type were not yet made by olds and they came from chevy and didn't hold up to the weight and torque of the olds, thus the shucking.
From what i understand, olds started putting "non-performance" o-types in a-bodies starting circa late spring, but i can find no documentation of this.
But the performance o-types (g88 3.91 and g92 3.42) were an option thru the end of the year. The p-type (g93 3.55 and g94 3.90) were still the standard issue thru the end of the year.
I have production figures that support this.
Ok -- heres my 2 cents worth --
my 67 w30 automatic (th400) car came from factory with type p 4-cone posi with 3.90 gears and th cold --- that code is found with 66 codes and bodes well with the last minute decision to switch to the type p rears for the w cars. As kurt has said --- 4.33 with the q codes were used in the 4-speed w cars, but the automatic cars all got the 3.90 as std. As for the tube code on a type p 4-cone posi with an otional ratio in a w30 automatic car?? Your guess is as good as mine. Never knew of one --- of course thats not to say that there werent any???
In fact, not many of the performance o-types (g88 3.91 and g92 3.42) made it into production in '67: Only approx 100 of each, and most of them during the last few months.
From what i understand, olds started putting "non-performance" o-types in a-bodies starting circa late spring, but i can find no documentation of this.
But the performance o-types (g88 3.91 and g92 3.42) were an option thru the end of the year. The p-type (g93 3.55 and g94 3.90) were still the standard issue thru the end of the year.
I have production figures that support this.
Ok -- heres my 2 cents worth --
my 67 w30 automatic (th400) car came from factory with type p 4-cone posi with 3.90 gears and th cold --- that code is found with 66 codes and bodes well with the last minute decision to switch to the type p rears for the w cars. As kurt has said --- 4.33 with the q codes were used in the 4-speed w cars, but the automatic cars all got the 3.90 as std. As for the tube code on a type p 4-cone posi with an otional ratio in a w30 automatic car?? Your guess is as good as mine. Never knew of one --- of course thats not to say that there werent any???
In fact, not many of the performance o-types (g88 3.91 and g92 3.42) made it into production in '67: Only approx 100 of each, and most of them during the last few months.
#13
Again -- my 2 cents worth! But what do i know ?? I only bought one of the 125 or so units produced with TH400 and saw with my own eyes what was in it from the factory!!
#14
I do not believe that is true. None of the '67 W30s came with O-types. The O-type was originally slated to be used for the '67 W30s as late as December (still prior to when any were built), but early tests found them "shucking gears" in the O-types and they changed to the P-type with the 4-pinion carrier and went to 4.33 gears as standard. Word was the steeper gears for the O-type were not yet made by Olds and they came from Chevy and didn't hold up to the weight and torque of the Olds, thus the shucking.
From what I understand, Olds started putting "non-performance" O-types in A-bodies starting circa late spring, but I can find no documentation of this.
But the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) were an option thru the end of the year. The P-type (G93 3.55 and G94 3.90) were still the standard issue thru the end of the year.
I have production figures that support this.
In fact, not many of the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) made it into production in '67: only approx 100 of each, and most of them during the last few months.
From what I understand, Olds started putting "non-performance" O-types in A-bodies starting circa late spring, but I can find no documentation of this.
But the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) were an option thru the end of the year. The P-type (G93 3.55 and G94 3.90) were still the standard issue thru the end of the year.
I have production figures that support this.
In fact, not many of the performance O-types (G88 3.91 and G92 3.42) made it into production in '67: only approx 100 of each, and most of them during the last few months.
#15
My book shows SJ code 4.55 anti-spin for a 66. No listing in my resource of SJ code being used in 67. I suppose it COULD MAYBE be akin to my TH as its code was listed in the 66 group also? I would have my doubts. My logical guess is that this rear in question is a 66 442 unit.??
Again -- my 2 cents worth! But what do i know ?? I only bought one of the 125 or so units produced with TH400 and saw with my own eyes what was in it from the factory!!
Again -- my 2 cents worth! But what do i know ?? I only bought one of the 125 or so units produced with TH400 and saw with my own eyes what was in it from the factory!!
#16
My book shows SJ code 3.55 anti-spin for a 66. No listing in my resource of SJ code being used in 67. I suppose it COULD MAYBE be akin to my TH as its code was listed in the 66 group also? I would have my doubts. My logical guess is that this rear in question is a 66 442 unit.??
#17
The Type O was in production by May 1966 and was discussed in that month's Service Guild. The 4.33 gears for it were available through GMPD by October 1, 1966. The 4.66 was not shown in the Jan 67 price schedule so it came out later than that; the 5.00 ratio was produced after 12-67 as it does not appear in that month's parts book.
It has become popular among ebayers to call everything for Olds a W30 part. you can find W30 radios, etc. these days
It has become popular among ebayers to call everything for Olds a W30 part. you can find W30 radios, etc. these days
#19
Im just pulling a SJ code 3.55 posi with the 4-pinion carrier rear.............................................. ............................................
Out of a .................................................. .................................................. .....................................
67 442
Does that mean i can sell it as a w30 rear ?
Last edited by f-85; December 14th, 2011 at 12:19 PM.
#20
Im just pulling a SJ code 3.55 posi with the 4-pinion carrier rear.............................................. ............................................
Out of a .................................................. .................................................. .....................................
67 442
Does that mean i can sell it as a w30 rear ?
Out of a .................................................. .................................................. .....................................
67 442
Does that mean i can sell it as a w30 rear ?
#21
Thanks
wmachine@shubes.net
#22
Can you get me the body tag info from that car? I'm keeping track of where I can find them! A pic would be great.
Thanks
wmachine@shubes.net
Thanks
wmachine@shubes.net
#25
#26
Thanks again. Of note, the latest '67 model build I've found was built the 4th week of July. The earliest I have was built the 5th week of Aug.! ('66)
#27
Well thats cool. Interesting info. Thats really cool that you save it and keep record. Did you get the info off the red 67 442 i just had? That one went to Utah and is getting restored.
#28
My '67 442 has an M21 trans and 3:90 gears (IIRC, "TH" code). its a relatively early (Oct. 66) build car. Short of pulling the cover, is there any way for me to tell if its a 4 pinion or not? Not that I'd do much with that info. (and being its a vert, can't very well claim its a W30 even if I was inclined to). Still, Im curious (just not so curious to pull the cover for no good reason).
#29
My '67 442 has an M21 trans and 3:90 gears (IIRC, "TH" code). its a relatively early (Oct. 66) build car. Short of pulling the cover, is there any way for me to tell if its a 4 pinion or not? Not that I'd do much with that info. (and being its a vert, can't very well claim its a W30 even if I was inclined to). Still, Im curious (just not so curious to pull the cover for no good reason).
#32
#33
I just picked up a 66' 442 4 speed convertible and has all the signs that it is a legit car. On one of the web sites it shows a V on the body tag same as the V on this body tag. Anyway it said that the V was for 442 trim, does this verify it is a 442.
Kelly
Kelly
#34
A couple of things to add to this conversation. I have seen a 4 pin posi in a very late 07D build 66 442,so that would lend credence that all 67 cars had the 4 pin posi. Like previously posted,only the 3.55 and lower (numerically higher) rears would have the 4 pin posi. There was a 67 3.23 posi rear for sale on ROP and I had the guy check it and it was a 2 pin unit. I know of two 67 442's that came with the type O 3.08 posi rear. How many of you knew they made two different 2 pin posi units? There was the smaller pin and the larger pin units.
How about the very elusive 67 W 30 4.11 rear? I had a 67 W-30 that had a 4.11 rear. You could see where the original code 'SD' had been hammered to hide it and a Q? stamped next to it. This was way back in the day when we didn't document like we do now. I talked to Curt Anderson about this rear when I got it and next time I talk to him,I'll see if he kept the info. The car also had the very rare shoulder harness option,I sent them to Curt. If you look in the 67 PIM (aka assembly manual) in section 4,page 1.04 you will see the performance axle G-80 & G-89 L-78 W30 only 4.11 rear axle ratio.I did not get the build date from the car,so that's unknown. I put the rear under a 66 442 track pack car I sold to a guy in CA. It's a black Sport Coupe with red interior and was owned by Jim Stohlman after the guy I sold it to. I talked to a guy @ the MN Nats in 04(I think) that bought the car from Jim Stohlman. I told him about the rear end and he said he would check it and let me know but I never heard from him. The car was originally a 3 speed car,so if anybody knows of a 66 442 black/red OAI car with a 2B on the cowl tag,check it out for the rear I put in the car. I know that most of the W30 cars had the 4.33 but I'm telling you that the 67 W 30 I had,had a 4.11 posi,was it factory? not knowing the complete history it's hard to say. The drawing of that page in the PIM had a revision date of 8-66,so it could be that they had intended to continue the 66 W 30 4.11 ratio into the 67 W 30 production. Maybe the very early 67 W 30 cars had the 4.11 and the later cars the 4.33,I can't say but I'm positive the rear I had came in the car because I do remember it had the 67 spring mounts. If anybody can add to this,I would very much like to hear from you.
Thanks
Mike
How about the very elusive 67 W 30 4.11 rear? I had a 67 W-30 that had a 4.11 rear. You could see where the original code 'SD' had been hammered to hide it and a Q? stamped next to it. This was way back in the day when we didn't document like we do now. I talked to Curt Anderson about this rear when I got it and next time I talk to him,I'll see if he kept the info. The car also had the very rare shoulder harness option,I sent them to Curt. If you look in the 67 PIM (aka assembly manual) in section 4,page 1.04 you will see the performance axle G-80 & G-89 L-78 W30 only 4.11 rear axle ratio.I did not get the build date from the car,so that's unknown. I put the rear under a 66 442 track pack car I sold to a guy in CA. It's a black Sport Coupe with red interior and was owned by Jim Stohlman after the guy I sold it to. I talked to a guy @ the MN Nats in 04(I think) that bought the car from Jim Stohlman. I told him about the rear end and he said he would check it and let me know but I never heard from him. The car was originally a 3 speed car,so if anybody knows of a 66 442 black/red OAI car with a 2B on the cowl tag,check it out for the rear I put in the car. I know that most of the W30 cars had the 4.33 but I'm telling you that the 67 W 30 I had,had a 4.11 posi,was it factory? not knowing the complete history it's hard to say. The drawing of that page in the PIM had a revision date of 8-66,so it could be that they had intended to continue the 66 W 30 4.11 ratio into the 67 W 30 production. Maybe the very early 67 W 30 cars had the 4.11 and the later cars the 4.33,I can't say but I'm positive the rear I had came in the car because I do remember it had the 67 spring mounts. If anybody can add to this,I would very much like to hear from you.
Thanks
Mike
Last edited by 66-3X2 442; February 18th, 2012 at 08:47 PM.
#35
While we're on the rear end subject,I have a very nice clean 67 442 posi (code TH) 3.90 type "P' rear axle for sale. It came from a 50K mile car that sat for many many years. It's very clean inside and no visible wear or broken parts. Oddly enough,it came from a 3 speed car. $1,000 + shipping.
Thanks
Mike
Thanks
Mike
Last edited by 66-3X2 442; February 18th, 2012 at 08:57 PM.
#36
YES,5V denotes the 442 option in 66 & 67 except on Fremont cars that do not have option codes on the cowl tags.
#37
How about the very elusive 67 W 30 4.11 rear? I had a 67 W-30 that had a 4.11 rear. You could see where the original code 'SD' had been hammered to hide it and a Q? stamped next to it. This was way back in the day when we didn't document like we do now. I talked to Curt Anderson about this rear when I got it and next time I talk to him,I'll see if he kept the info. ...............The drawing of that page in the PIM had a revision date of 8-66,so it could be that they had intended to continue the 66 W 30 4.11 ratio into the 67 W 30 production. Maybe the very early 67 W 30 cars had the 4.11 and the later cars the 4.33,I can't say but I'm positive the rear I had came in the car because I do remember it had the 67 spring mounts. If anybody can add to this,I would very much like to hear from you.
Mike
Mike
To add to what you said, I have a 1-5-67 to that page 394501 pg 1.04. It does not change any of this related info, but does bring the info up to January.
Also, go to page 1.06 . I believe you'll have 11/11/66 revision. I have a 1/5/67 revision to that too. And that *does* show significant change:
Rev Y on 12/9/66 changes the Q5/Q9 codes change from 4.11 to 4.33. Interesting that the same code was used for 2 different ratios. And this was well before the '67 W30 production starting in February.
Significant also is that with as of this 1/5/67 revision level, they also *removed* the Q7 and Q3 4.11 option from the "O" Olds rears, leaving the 3.91 as the max gear in the "O" rear.
This is all supporting info on how Olds went back to the 10-bolt (instead of their new "O" rear) for the '67 W30s.
With 4.33, 3.90, and 3.55 as "available" gears for the '67 W30, it wouldn't surprise me that someone would want 4.11s. My guess is that the 4.11s you had were dealer installed.
FWIW, I have a Q5 P-type rear that came out of a '67 W30.
#38
Good info, Mike.
To add to what you said, I have a 1-5-67 to that page 394501 pg 1.04. It does not change any of this related info, but does bring the info up to January.
Also, go to page 1.06 . I believe you'll have 11/11/66 revision. I have a 1/5/67 revision to that too. And that *does* show significant change:
Rev Y on 12/9/66 changes the Q5/Q9 codes change from 4.11 to 4.33. Interesting that the same code was used for 2 different ratios. And this was well before the '67 W30 production starting in February.
Significant also is that with as of this 1/5/67 revision level, they also *removed* the Q7 and Q3 4.11 option from the "O" Olds rears, leaving the 3.91 as the max gear in the "O" rear.
This is all supporting info on how Olds went back to the 10-bolt (instead of their new "O" rear) for the '67 W30s.
With 4.33, 3.90, and 3.55 as "available" gears for the '67 W30, it wouldn't surprise me that someone would want 4.11s. My guess is that the 4.11s you had were dealer installed.
FWIW, I have a Q5 P-type rear that came out of a '67 W30.
To add to what you said, I have a 1-5-67 to that page 394501 pg 1.04. It does not change any of this related info, but does bring the info up to January.
Also, go to page 1.06 . I believe you'll have 11/11/66 revision. I have a 1/5/67 revision to that too. And that *does* show significant change:
Rev Y on 12/9/66 changes the Q5/Q9 codes change from 4.11 to 4.33. Interesting that the same code was used for 2 different ratios. And this was well before the '67 W30 production starting in February.
Significant also is that with as of this 1/5/67 revision level, they also *removed* the Q7 and Q3 4.11 option from the "O" Olds rears, leaving the 3.91 as the max gear in the "O" rear.
This is all supporting info on how Olds went back to the 10-bolt (instead of their new "O" rear) for the '67 W30s.
With 4.33, 3.90, and 3.55 as "available" gears for the '67 W30, it wouldn't surprise me that someone would want 4.11s. My guess is that the 4.11s you had were dealer installed.
FWIW, I have a Q5 P-type rear that came out of a '67 W30.
Yes,that's very possible that the 4.11 gears were dealer installed and as I said,not knowing the complete history of the car,anything is possible. The only thing that got my curiosity up was the hammering of the SD code and the Q? code stamped next to it. I called Curt this morning and he remembers the rear and he's still pi$$ed I didn't get a picture of it. He's going to dig through his stack and see if he kept any of the info I gave him. My page 1.06 is the 11-11-66 revision and I would like to get any of the updated pages if I could from you. I'm not in to 67's but I like learning bout them. I can send you the info on my car if you still want it. It's better for me to fax it,my scanner isn't working.
Thanks
Mike
#40
A couple of things to add to this conversation. I have seen a 4 pin posi in a very late 07D build 66 442,so that would lend credence that all 67 cars had the 4 pin posi. Like previously posted,only the 3.55 and lower (numerically higher) rears would have the 4 pin posi. There was a 67 3.23 posi rear for sale on ROP and I had the guy check it and it was a 2 pin unit. I know of two 67 442's that came with the type O 3.08 posi rear. How many of you knew they made two different 2 pin posi units? There was the smaller pin and the larger pin units.
How about the very elusive 67 W 30 4.11 rear? I had a 67 W-30 that had a 4.11 rear. You could see where the original code 'SD' had been hammered to hide it and a Q? stamped next to it. This was way back in the day when we didn't document like we do now. I talked to Curt Anderson about this rear when I got it and next time I talk to him,I'll see if he kept the info. The car also had the very rare shoulder harness option,I sent them to Curt. If you look in the 67 PIM (aka assembly manual) in section 4,page 1.04 you will see the performance axle G-80 & G-89 L-78 W30 only 4.11 rear axle ratio.I did not get the build date from the car,so that's unknown. I put the rear under a 66 442 track pack car I sold to a guy in CA. It's a black Sport Coupe with red interior and was owned by Jim Stohlman after the guy I sold it to. I talked to a guy @ the MN Nats in 04(I think) that bought the car from Jim Stohlman. I told him about the rear end and he said he would check it and let me know but I never heard from him. The car was originally a 3 speed car,so if anybody knows of a 66 442 black/red OAI car with a 2B on the cowl tag,check it out for the rear I put in the car. I know that most of the W30 cars had the 4.33 but I'm telling you that the 67 W 30 I had,had a 4.11 posi,was it factory? not knowing the complete history it's hard to say. The drawing of that page in the PIM had a revision date of 8-66,so it could be that they had intended to continue the 66 W 30 4.11 ratio into the 67 W 30 production. Maybe the very early 67 W 30 cars had the 4.11 and the later cars the 4.33,I can't say but I'm positive the rear I had came in the car because I do remember it had the 67 spring mounts. If anybody can add to this,I would very much like to hear from you.
Thanks
Mike
How about the very elusive 67 W 30 4.11 rear? I had a 67 W-30 that had a 4.11 rear. You could see where the original code 'SD' had been hammered to hide it and a Q? stamped next to it. This was way back in the day when we didn't document like we do now. I talked to Curt Anderson about this rear when I got it and next time I talk to him,I'll see if he kept the info. The car also had the very rare shoulder harness option,I sent them to Curt. If you look in the 67 PIM (aka assembly manual) in section 4,page 1.04 you will see the performance axle G-80 & G-89 L-78 W30 only 4.11 rear axle ratio.I did not get the build date from the car,so that's unknown. I put the rear under a 66 442 track pack car I sold to a guy in CA. It's a black Sport Coupe with red interior and was owned by Jim Stohlman after the guy I sold it to. I talked to a guy @ the MN Nats in 04(I think) that bought the car from Jim Stohlman. I told him about the rear end and he said he would check it and let me know but I never heard from him. The car was originally a 3 speed car,so if anybody knows of a 66 442 black/red OAI car with a 2B on the cowl tag,check it out for the rear I put in the car. I know that most of the W30 cars had the 4.33 but I'm telling you that the 67 W 30 I had,had a 4.11 posi,was it factory? not knowing the complete history it's hard to say. The drawing of that page in the PIM had a revision date of 8-66,so it could be that they had intended to continue the 66 W 30 4.11 ratio into the 67 W 30 production. Maybe the very early 67 W 30 cars had the 4.11 and the later cars the 4.33,I can't say but I'm positive the rear I had came in the car because I do remember it had the 67 spring mounts. If anybody can add to this,I would very much like to hear from you.
Thanks
Mike