is my olds a fake

semper-fi · October 26th, 2009, 01:21 AM

I have a 1969 olds 442 hurst 455 big block how do I tell if it original just wondering if my 1969 olds 442 is an original or fake the vin # is 344879z107669 the z might b a 2 above the water pump it says pacific auto machine 368 and it also says 396021f the 2 might b a z here r some pics of the car

egknz · October 26th, 2009, 02:39 AM

IF the parts are high it's probably the real deal LOL

Jamesbo · October 26th, 2009, 06:14 AM

Sorry,

I'm a mitght confused. There is a 69 442 with a 400 engine and there is a 69 Hurst Olds with a 455 engine.

Are you speaking of just the engine or the car?

Tell us more so we can help you out please.

Oldsguy · October 26th, 2009, 06:48 AM

I would just add, regardless if the car is complete and original (not fake) or not as long as it is all Oldsmobile don't worry. I guess unless you purchased it for a very high price and it was presented to you as something it may not be. If that is the case Jamesbo (and numerous others) will be able to help you out identifying your car. VIN, photos, engine ID, etc will all help in that effort. Finally, Welcome to CO!

Olds64 · October 26th, 2009, 07:00 AM

OMG!

I can't believe you bought a 1969 Oldsmobile 442 with a 455. That was the elusive Chevy Chevelle that was actually sold as an Oldsmobile in the last 1/4 of 1969. It actually isn't an Oldsmobile at all and wasn't a very cool Chevelle at that. You were bamboozled!

stevengerard · October 26th, 2009, 07:09 AM

welcome, post some pics and check the vin number onb the dash and compare it to the engine etc

2blu442 · October 26th, 2009, 07:12 AM

Welcome to the site!

As the other guys said please provide more information and we'll help answer your questions. For starters though, if your car is a 442 and it has a 455 then the engine has been swapped. All 442's would have come with 400 cubic inch motors. Then an easy step is to check the vin number, all 442's would have a vin number starting with 344.

The Hurst Olds was a complete different creature from the 442, and the white/gold car Jamesbo has is a 1969 Hurst Olds. Much lower production number.

So if you'll provide more details and some photos we can help you key it out to see if it's one of the above or a Cutlass with the emblems changed. John

citcapp · October 26th, 2009, 08:24 AM

Post pictures and the Vin number and the 69'er group will help you out. They live for this stuff

1ATony · October 26th, 2009, 01:23 PM

Welcome to the site.

Lovin87olds · November 6th, 2009, 09:34 AM

I was told once at a car show that my car is a fake, I don't believe this since I am the 3rd owner and i know the guy before me had purchased it with 21k and got it out of a barn. What i know about may car is it is a 1987 Old's Cutlass Salon with t-tops a 231 v-6 2bbl Rochester dual jet carb, power seats, power windows, and a floor shifter. I'll have to go to the garage later and get the vin.

joe_padavano · November 6th, 2009, 09:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lovin87olds

I was told once at a car show that my car is a fake, I don't believe this since I am the 3rd owner and i know the guy before me had purchased it with 21k and got it out of a barn. What i know about may car is it is a 1987 Old's Cutlass Salon with t-tops a 231 v-6 2bbl Rochester dual jet carb, power seats, power windows, and a floor shifter. I'll have to go to the garage later and get the vin.

A fake what? Is it really a bicycle? Do these "experts" think that someone took an 87 442 and turned it into a V6 salon clone?

jslabotsky · November 6th, 2009, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

A fake what? Is it really a bicycle? Do these "experts" think that someone took an 87 442 and turned it into a V6 salon clone?

I didn't think the G-body Salon was available with the V6.

I thought they all had the same mechanical equipment as a 442.

Anyway, will be curious to see what info. the original poster puts up. Hopefully he didn't pay big bucks for a forgery.

Lovin87olds · November 6th, 2009, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jslabotsky

I didn't think the G-body Salon was available with the V6.

I thought they all had the same mechanical equipment as a 442.

Anyway, will be curious to see what info. the original poster puts up. Hopefully he didn't pay big bucks for a forgery.

That would be nice to know. Maybe GM just slapped some of them together with remaining parts, but if it was supposed to have the same mechanical equipment as a 442 I'd love to know. I wanna keep this car as original as possible.

wolfman98 · November 6th, 2009, 10:11 AM

This thread is about a 69 H/O that may or may not be a fake. semper-fi needs to post the VIN and engine #'s so these guys can help himout with info.

Lovin87olds · November 6th, 2009, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semper-fi

I have a 1969 olds 442 hurst 455 big block how do I tell if it original

I wouldn't be surprised if someone swapped the engine. I know a few people with Old's and they have swapped the originals out for the 455. Maybe that's just the 'in' thing to do around these parts though

Bluevista · November 6th, 2009, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

A fake what? Is it really a bicycle? Do these "experts" think that someone took an 87 442 and turned it into a V6 salon clone?

cutlassgal · November 6th, 2009, 02:10 PM

Yeah, what he said!!

marcar1993 · November 7th, 2009, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jslabotsky

I didn't think the G-body Salon was available with the V6.

I thought they all had the same mechanical equipment as a 442.

Anyway, will be curious to see what info. the original poster puts up. Hopefully he didn't pay big bucks for a forgery.

Yes they did make them with the v6. My neighbor had a cream 87 salon v6. Buckets, gauges, ect...

semper-fi · November 9th, 2009, 03:25 PM

just wondering if my 1969 olds 442 is an original or fake the vin # is 344879z107669 the z might b a 2 above the water pump it says pacific auto machine 368 and it also says 396021f the 2 might b a z here r some pics of the car

citcapp · November 9th, 2009, 05:40 PM

I merged this with your previous thread where you asked the same question. We have been waiting for your vin. Now your question can be answered

svnt442 · November 9th, 2009, 06:54 PM

Well the car is a 442 for sure that was made in Fremont CA. It is a Z and not a 2.

As far as the casting numbers that just shows you have a 455. You need to look at the machined pad just below #1 spark plug on the block. If you have the original engine to your car it WILL read as follows 39Z107669. That will also be a definitive indicator that you have a H/O as no other A body had anything over 400 CID until 1970.

H/O guys did they make the H/O anywhere but Lansing? I would think having a Fremont car it would be prohibitive to "hide" the fact that the engines were actually installed on the line and not at the Hurst facility.

rocketraider · November 9th, 2009, 08:14 PM

To my knowledge all Hurst were Lansing production. I've never seen one that wasn't.

So, being a Fremont CA assembly plant car (Z), you have a 442 Holiday Coupe (4487) that has had a 68-71 455 engine (396021F) installed. Which in itself is not a bad thing, you just don't have a 1969 Hurst/Olds.

I suggested in the other thread that if it turned out to not be real, restore it as a Hurst/Olds appearance tribute and enjoy the car anyway, and don't get hung up on fakes/numbers matching/values. Worrying about schit like that has taken the joy of ownership out of many otherwise nice cars.

Marine, don't get discouraged. Stick around here and we'll help you make that car the best it can be, or as far as you want to take it.

joe_padavano · November 10th, 2009, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketraider

To my knowledge all Hurst were Lansing production. I've never seen one that wasn't.

You are correct.

wmachine · November 10th, 2009, 09:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocketraider

I suggested in the other thread that if it turned out to not be real, restore it as a Hurst/Olds appearance tribute and enjoy the car anyway, and don't get hung up on fakes/numbers matching/values. Worrying about schit like that has taken the joy of ownership out of many otherwise nice cars.

Marine, don't get discouraged. Stick around here and we'll help you make that car the best it can be, or as far as you want to take it.

X2. If it is a nice car, it is no less nice just because it isn't an original Hurst. If it is equipped like one, it will ride and handle like one. Enjoy it for the great car that it is.

wolfman98 · November 10th, 2009, 03:13 PM

X3 enjoy it to the fullest , I would if it were mine.

semper-fi · November 10th, 2009, 03:51 PM

thank u for your help

semper-fi · November 10th, 2009, 03:53 PM

i paid 5500 from my grandpa for this car was it worth it

68conv455 · November 10th, 2009, 04:42 PM

Yes. It was worth it.
Enjoy it.

Z3d · November 10th, 2009, 04:49 PM

Are you saying your own grandpa charged you for it?

rocketraider · November 10th, 2009, 07:23 PM

$5500 for a running driving 1969 442 with a decent body is not bad money. You didn't get hurt. These cars are bringing serious coin even without the original engine.

Some grandpas aren't as generous as others

.

I'm guessing our Marine is still in high school?

442much · November 10th, 2009, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lovin87olds

I wouldn't be surprised if someone swapped the engine. I know a few people with Old's and they have swapped the originals out for the 455. Maybe that's just the 'in' thing to do around these parts though

The 455 is the correct engine for the 69 Hurst. The 400 was the correct engine for the 69 442.

442much · November 10th, 2009, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by semper-fi

i paid 5500 from my grandpa for this car was it worth it

Sweet Jesus you must be adopted! I don't know how a grandpa could do that to family. Because I'm a nice guy, I'll give you $6000 for it.

J/K

German442 · November 17th, 2009, 07:14 AM

......do I hear $6500??

Ralph

Quote:

Originally Posted by 442much

Because I'm a nice guy, I'll give you $6000 for it.

J/K

Jamesbo · November 17th, 2009, 07:30 AM

Semper-fi

Happy Birthday [late ]

Telll grandpa, I'm avaliable for adoption if he has any more cars for sale.

October 26th, 2009, 01:21 AM	#1 (permalink)
semper-fi Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 5	is my olds a fake I have a 1969 olds 442 hurst 455 big block how do I tell if it original just wondering if my 1969 olds 442 is an original or fake the vin # is 344879z107669 the z might b a 2 above the water pump it says pacific auto machine 368 and it also says 396021f the 2 might b a z here r some pics of the car Last edited by semper-fi; November 9th, 2009 at 03:50 PM.. Reason: i got the vin #

October 26th, 2009, 02:39 AM	#2 (permalink)
egknz 1972 Cutlass Supreme 455 Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Dallas Posts: 64	IF the parts are high it's probably the real deal LOL __________________ CYA !!

October 26th, 2009, 06:14 AM	#3 (permalink)
Jamesbo Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 2,854	Splain more better??? Sorry, I'm a mitght confused. There is a 69 442 with a 400 engine and there is a 69 Hurst Olds with a 455 engine. Are you speaking of just the engine or the car? Tell us more so we can help you out please. __________________ 69 H/O 69 442 convertible 69 Vista Cruiser 69 442 hardtop "Growing old is mandatory,Growing up is optional"

October 26th, 2009, 06:48 AM	#4 (permalink)
Oldsguy Hot Rodder at heart Administrator Join Date: May 2004 Location: Lees Summit MO Posts: 5,360	I would just add, regardless if the car is complete and original (not fake) or not as long as it is all Oldsmobile don't worry. I guess unless you purchased it for a very high price and it was presented to you as something it may not be. If that is the case Jamesbo (and numerous others) will be able to help you out identifying your car. VIN, photos, engine ID, etc will all help in that effort. Finally, Welcome to CO! __________________ Dan '77 Cutlass Supreme '46 2 door "The rocket 455.....it's a sledgehammer approach to a thumbtack world" LuxBlue of HAMB.

October 26th, 2009, 07:00 AM	#5 (permalink)
Olds64 Landyacht Club President Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 4,286	OMG! I can't believe you bought a 1969 Oldsmobile 442 with a 455. That was the elusive Chevy Chevelle that was actually sold as an Oldsmobile in the last 1/4 of 1969. It actually isn't an Oldsmobile at all and wasn't a very cool Chevelle at that. You were bamboozled! __________________ Ferris, my father loves this car more than life itself... Apparently, you don't understand! Ferris, he never drives it! He just rubs it with a diaper! Cameron Frye Ferris Bueller's Day Off 1986

October 26th, 2009, 07:09 AM	#6 (permalink)
stevengerard Registered User Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 188	welcome, post some pics and check the vin number onb the dash and compare it to the engine etc __________________ Steven 1970 442 W-30 Convertible 2004 Mercury Marauder (beaten like a rented mule)

October 26th, 2009, 07:12 AM	#7 (permalink)
2blu442 Moderator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Medford, Oregon Posts: 2,256	Welcome to the site! As the other guys said please provide more information and we'll help answer your questions. For starters though, if your car is a 442 and it has a 455 then the engine has been swapped. All 442's would have come with 400 cubic inch motors. Then an easy step is to check the vin number, all 442's would have a vin number starting with 344. The Hurst Olds was a complete different creature from the 442, and the white/gold car Jamesbo has is a 1969 Hurst Olds. Much lower production number. So if you'll provide more details and some photos we can help you key it out to see if it's one of the above or a Cutlass with the emblems changed. John __________________ 1964 Cutlass Factory 4spd 1965 442 4spd 1967 442 Auto 1967 Cutlass Convertible 1967 Cutlass four door daily driver 1968 442 Auto 1969 442 W30 Auto 1970 442 4spd 1971 Cutlass Flat Top Wagon 1973 Chevy 3/4 Ton 454/TH400 Tow Vehicle Only the tow vehicle is finished! Last edited by 2blu442; October 26th, 2009 at 07:15 AM..*

October 26th, 2009, 08:24 AM	#8 (permalink)
citcapp Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,440	Welcome to CO Post pictures and the Vin number and the 69'er group will help you out. They live for this stuff __________________ Pat 1957 Super 88 with a 455 1948 2dr series 76 with a 455

October 26th, 2009, 01:23 PM	#9 (permalink)
1ATony Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 110	Welcome to the site.

November 6th, 2009, 09:34 AM	#10 (permalink)
Lovin87olds Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Buffalo, New York Posts: 17	I was told once at a car show that my car is a fake, I don't believe this since I am the 3rd owner and i know the guy before me had purchased it with 21k and got it out of a barn. What i know about may car is it is a 1987 Old's Cutlass Salon with t-tops a 231 v-6 2bbl Rochester dual jet carb, power seats, power windows, and a floor shifter. I'll have to go to the garage later and get the vin.

November 6th, 2009, 10:11 AM	#14 (permalink)
wolfman98 Captain of my ship Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Wilmot , Nova Scotia , Canada Posts: 1,293	This thread is about a 69 H/O that may or may not be a fake. semper-fi needs to post the VIN and engine #'s so these guys can help himout with info. __________________ Now to keep her clean!! 52 Chev Styleline Deluxe (sold Nov.9th) 69 nighty-eight convertible 90 astro all wheel LT 01 TL80 New Holland 07 Colorado LT

November 6th, 2009, 02:10 PM	#17 (permalink)
cutlassgal Cutlass Lover Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Twinsburg, Ohio Posts: 791	Yeah, what he said!! __________________ -x-"If your friends could see you now!"-x-

November 9th, 2009, 05:40 PM	#20 (permalink)
citcapp Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,440	I merged this with your previous thread where you asked the same question. We have been waiting for your vin. Now your question can be answered __________________ Pat 1957 Super 88 with a 455 1948 2dr series 76 with a 455

November 9th, 2009, 06:54 PM	#21 (permalink)
svnt442 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 453	Well the car is a 442 for sure that was made in Fremont CA. It is a Z and not a 2. As far as the casting numbers that just shows you have a 455. You need to look at the machined pad just below #1 spark plug on the block. If you have the original engine to your car it WILL read as follows 39Z107669. That will also be a definitive indicator that you have a H/O as no other A body had anything over 400 CID until 1970. H/O guys did they make the H/O anywhere but Lansing? I would think having a Fremont car it would be prohibitive to "hide" the fact that the engines were actually installed on the line and not at the Hurst facility. __________________ Randy 1970 442

November 9th, 2009, 08:14 PM	#22 (permalink)
rocketraider Oldsdruid Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Danville Vajenya, the Last Capital of Dixie Posts: 1,214	To my knowledge all Hurst were Lansing production. I've never seen one that wasn't. So, being a Fremont CA assembly plant car (Z), you have a 442 Holiday Coupe (4487) that has had a 68-71 455 engine (396021F) installed. Which in itself is not a bad thing, you just don't have a 1969 Hurst/Olds. I suggested in the other thread that if it turned out to not be real, restore it as a Hurst/Olds appearance tribute and enjoy the car anyway, and don't get hung up on fakes/numbers matching/values. Worrying about schit like that has taken the joy of ownership out of many otherwise nice cars. Marine, don't get discouraged. Stick around here and we'll help you make that car the best it can be, or as far as you want to take it. __________________ I know absolutely nothing about Oldsmobiles. Just ask the owner of Oldspower.com

November 10th, 2009, 03:13 PM	#25 (permalink)
wolfman98 Captain of my ship Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Wilmot , Nova Scotia , Canada Posts: 1,293	X3 enjoy it to the fullest , I would if it were mine. __________________ Now to keep her clean!! 52 Chev Styleline Deluxe (sold Nov.9th) 69 nighty-eight convertible 90 astro all wheel LT 01 TL80 New Holland 07 Colorado LT

November 10th, 2009, 03:51 PM	#26 (permalink)
semper-fi Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 5	thank u for your help

November 10th, 2009, 03:53 PM	#27 (permalink)
semper-fi Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 5	i paid 5500 from my grandpa for this car was it worth it

November 10th, 2009, 04:42 PM	#28 (permalink)
68conv455 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 259	Yes. It was worth it. Enjoy it.

November 10th, 2009, 04:49 PM	#29 (permalink)
Z3d Super User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Michigan Posts: 44	Are you saying your own grandpa charged you for it? __________________

November 10th, 2009, 07:23 PM	#30 (permalink)
rocketraider Oldsdruid Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Danville Vajenya, the Last Capital of Dixie Posts: 1,214	$5500 for a running driving 1969 442 with a decent body is not bad money. You didn't get hurt. These cars are bringing serious coin even without the original engine. Some grandpas aren't as generous as others. I'm guessing our Marine is still in high school? __________________ I know absolutely nothing about Oldsmobiles. Just ask the owner of Oldspower.com

November 17th, 2009, 07:30 AM	#34 (permalink)
Jamesbo Super Moderator Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 2,854	Semper-fi Happy Birthday [late ] Telll grandpa, I'm avaliable for adoption if he has any more cars for sale. __________________ 69 H/O 69 442 convertible 69 Vista Cruiser 69 442 hardtop "Growing old is mandatory,Growing up is optional"

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